DiscussionHow do you see the trans movement in the next 5 years?

submitted by joy1090 from self.LGBDropTheT

Would you see a backlash? Would women in Europe and America finally reclaim their spaces? Would gen z kids finally wake up from the indoctrination they've been fed to via Twitter and realize trans women are NOT women? Would LGB finally drop the T? Would there be lawsuits against big pharma?

Thoughts?

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[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 50 insightful - 2 fun50 insightful - 1 fun51 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Considering how fast things have escalated, within 5 years we will see the movement ensconced in a deluge of litigation. Particularly as those in college right now will have been forced to try to adapt to the real world. And they will of course cause mess for the rest of us, but they will come up hard against the limits of what they cannot control. These SJWs are not going to be able to serve underprivileged neighborhoods, the homeless, or volunteer in developing countries if they are pronoun-dependent.

Edit: What terrifies me is that “trans kids” is likely to persist the longest because the kids are being indoctrinated by schools and narcissistic parents so young. It may be a long time until we see the full impact of that and it brings me to tears thinking about those poor kids. In 5 years, Jazz Jennings will still be only 25, the age when he will reach mental maturity. How much more botched surgery will he have in that time? Our only hope is that the discovery in other areas will bring in enough scrutiny to take a step back and look objectively at transing kids. Areas we’ll see backlash sooner are (1) botched surgeries, (2) mass influx of males overwhelming female prisons and ensuing assaults on women, (3) women’s sports being destroyed, (4) mass sexual assaults by trans-identified males on women in women’s spaces, and (5) women finally realizing en masse that “woman” and “female” are becoming taboo words unless they’re describing men.

Edit 2: It’s also only a matter of time before well-intentioned handmaidens peak. We all do unless we’re narcissists. Sooner or later they will be on the wrong side of an AGP creep who will be emboldened by all of the public support. Sooner or later they will run into a situation where they must come headfirst with the unmistakable conclusion that biological sex is relevant to their life experiences and that they need to maintain the language to discuss those issues. Sooner or later, they will be forced to use or observe someone they care about be forced to use pronouns in a way that feels de-humanizing and misogynistic. Sooner or later they will be canceled for something innocuous or completely fabricated.

As I said, we all peak. Hopefully it’s before they are old enough to be branded Karens and told to shut up forever.

[–]Shadow_Lurker 35 insightful - 2 fun35 insightful - 1 fun36 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

What terrifies me is that “trans kids” is likely persist the longest because the kids are being indoctrinated by schools and narcissistic parents so young.

This is not surprising, not only because of indoctrination but also the sunken cost falacy: by age 20 most of these 'trans kids' have invested so much of their lives on this shit that it becomes all that's left for them.

Case in point: if Jazz Jennings decides tomorrow to de-transition, what's he's going to do? He's not able to live as a normal male anymore, as there's a disaster between his legs and a mind of a pre-pubescent child on his head, and let's not forget his permanent hormonaly fucked body.

In a case like this, what's left if not the belief on a magical vagina fairy that's going to fix everything?

[–]IridescentAnacondastrictly dickly 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Read the comments in this post, specifically those written by "Maya K". Utterly heartbreaking! This is what is in store for many of these transed kids (and adults too).

[–]fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

(2) mass influx of males overwhelming female prisons and ensuing assaults on women, (3) women’s sports being destroyed, (4) mass sexual assaults by trans-identified males on women in women’s spaces,

This is not what's going to turn the tide, sorry to say. The "progressive "left" does not give a fuck about women, especially if you can throw the word "white" in there, and now you have a left-approved pass for full-on misogyny (which, gee, affects WOC as well. Who would've thought.)

Concern about how this is affecting women and their rights isn't what's going to do it. As is stands the biggest two-group battle within this whole thing seems to be trans women vs cis women, and you know which they care about.

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I somewhat disagree with you. Especially on the sports thing. Both liberal and conservative men are not OK with their daughters playing against males. It's a very peaking issue. It's the gateway issue for men into trans discussion. For them though, it's an open and shut case. They don't hear the discussion happening and don't realize all that people are serious and implementing changes into law allowing males into girl's/women's sports. I've heard similar concern about men in women's prisons. They say of course they'd identify as a woman to get out of men's prison, so it's ripe for abuse. The problem is visibility of these issues. Most people still don't know they're happening and that it's widespread. I also think the Olympics would have been a very peaking moment for a lot of people, but that's now not going to happen any time soon, which is a shame.

[–]ChodeSandwichtender and moist 46 insightful - 4 fun46 insightful - 3 fun47 insightful - 4 fun -  (1 child)

Within the next few years, a bunch of spoiled college students will enter the real world and realize that burdening themselves with a trans identity did fuck all to ameliorate their social/emotional problems or make it easier to suck it up and get to work on time every day. Some of them will have already trashed their bodies and their mental health with permanent, experimental treatments. Their rich parents will open up a wave of lawsuits and write so many angry blogs about it that transing people under 20 will be given the same consideration as a lobotomy.

[–]fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

But this exact same thing was said 5 years ago and look where we're at. A lot of these people are well out of college and already in the working world.

[–]Shadow_Lurker 31 insightful - 1 fun31 insightful - 0 fun32 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

It's going to implode.

Today there's two antagonistic groups in transactivism: the 'truscum' and the 'tucutes'.

The 'tucutes' believe that there should be no gatekeeping on transgenderism at all, and I'm not talking about only in regards to access to HRT, but also to the transgender identity itself. 'Truscum', on the other hand, want to limit access to transgender identity by means of the medical diagnosis of gender disphoria as a requirement for taking it.

Nowadays, legislation in regards to transgenderism is based around the 'tucute' understanding of the subject: the only standard to someone to be considered transgender is to identify as such. This, for better or for worse, has caused a surge in the number of fetishists taking such identities, which is slowly but surely, changing the position of many in regards to this specific subject.

This will have a breaking point and it will force the TRA movement to either become 'truscum' or to discredit the idea of transgenderism as a whole. The choice they will make only time will tell.

[–]peaked2020 28 insightful - 1 fun28 insightful - 0 fun29 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I think “truscum” are not as reasonable as they try to pretend they are......

Like you say they say “gender dysphoria” is a condition of being trans. Here were the gender dysphoria conditions from the Mayo Clinic: “at least two of the following:

  • A marked incongruence between one’s experienced/expressed gender and primary and/or secondary sex characteristics

  • A strong desire to be rid of one’s primary and/or secondary sex characteristics

  • A strong desire for the primary and/or secondary sex characteristics of the other gender

  • A strong desire to be of the other gender

  • A strong desire to be treated as the other gender

  • A strong conviction that one has the typical feelings and reactions of the other gender

In children, gender dysphoria diagnosis involves at least six of the following :

  • A strong desire to be of the other gender or an insistence that one is the other gender

  • A strong preference for wearing clothes typical of the opposite gender

  • A strong preference for cross-gender roles in make-believe play or fantasy play

  • A strong preference for the toys, games or activities stereotypically used or engaged in by the other gender

  • A strong preference for playmates of the other gender

  • A strong rejection of toys, games and activities typical of one’s assigned gender

  • A strong dislike of one’s sexual anatomy

  • A strong desire for the physical sex characteristics that match one’s experienced gender”

The only way to really believe in this is if you’re really sexist and think that playing with dolls is only for girls. To put it into law you would have to say women must dress feminine otherwise it wouldn’t be fair because “cis” women can be tomboys but trans women can’t.

Tucutes are just trying to apply gender equality to trans. Which is hard because trans requires lack of gender equality...

[–]Shadow_Lurker 19 insightful - 1 fun19 insightful - 0 fun20 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I think “truscum” are not as reasonable as they try to pretend they are......

The way they treated Ariele Scarcella is already enough proof of that.

She gave them a larger platform and even defended them from attacks by other TRAs only for what? To be vilified and discarded when she was of no more use to them.

The only way to really believe in this is if you’re really sexist and think that playing with dolls is only for girls. To put it into law you would have to say women must dress feminine otherwise it wouldn’t be fair because “cis” women can be tomboys but trans women can’t.

Not only that, but also have you noticed how vague the criteria for the diagnosis of gender disphoria is?

It's how you said: it pathologies gender atypical behaviour by attaching a medical diagnosis and the need of a "treatment" to it. It's very regressive.

Tucutes are just trying to apply gender equality to trans. Which is hard because trans requires lack of gender equality...

I would not say so.

If tucutes really wanted gender equality they would recognise at least that the relativization of the concept of woman is damaging mainly to woman in the same way the relativization of the concept of black is damaging to blacks.

If you can't define in material terms the people you are fighting for, then how are going to articulate concrete demands to really around? You'll end up like the modern liberal feminist and LGBT movements, focusing on culture warrior bullshit instead of real problems, because as we all know, the main problem woman, gay and lesbian people face is that they are not represented in capeshit movies!

[–]peaked2020 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I’m not saying they’re doing a good job... only that they’re trying to avoid generalizing the sexes by saying “oh trans women can look any way and so can cis women”

[–]ChunkeeguyTeam T*RF Fuck Yeah 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

“truscum” are not as reasonable as they try to pretend they are.

Well they still hate biological women with a passion for a start

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think there are some reasonable transsexuals who transitioned long before this mess with the goal of better fitting into society. I think the kind of neo-transsexual truscum people are not that different from tucutes. They're just upset that tucutes are blowing their cover.

I also think that definition of gender dysphoria is very recent and would encompass many if not most kids, and certainly most gay or pre-gay kids. I say "pre-gay" just because I'm not comfortable ascribing sexual orientations to children, but I refer to those will be homosexual post-puberty.

[–]julesburm1891 28 insightful - 1 fun28 insightful - 0 fun29 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I’m honestly not sure if we’re going to see a complete backlash to this insanity or if we will go to the end of the rabbit hole. Neither would surprise me. Although, I have my fingers crossed for the former option.

[–]GConly 22 insightful - 1 fun22 insightful - 0 fun23 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The sporting bs will have collapsed before then. It's already starting to go.

The kids.. we're already seeing steps towards class actions about kids being shunted into puberty blockers etc all.

It will persist in the college's longer, they are pretty insulated from reality.

[–]Q-Continuum-kin 20 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 0 fun21 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Prediction:

Biden will win. Will re-roll back all executive orders from Obama era which Trump had undone. This includes military issues and more importantly, Title 9. This issue specifically triggers the general public because they don't want to see women having to compete with men in high school and college sports. Some states are already fighting this in court. It will end up going to the SCOTUS where the new extreme right wing justices will find a way to rule against Biden due to bigotry rather than for protecting women as a class. This will cause some backlash and they will keep pushing for sympathy because they were attacked by the evil right wing courts.

In the UK the gender clinic might get reforms to stop transitioning underage girls but everyone involved will distort history and claim that the detransitioners never happened and keep pushing gender stereotype bs because they make money doing this.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Do you happen to own your own tarot reading clinic?Because if you do I want lotto numbers from you.

[–]our_team_is_winning 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

If the lockdowns continue: tens of millions will fall into dire poverty in the very countries where trans is all the rage; when people are living in their cars and hungry, few will be in the mood to entertain gender nonsense.

If the Western nations open back up and recover, still people have had an awful taste of hardship, and still might not be in the mood to deal with genderspecials.

Or young people become even more internet addicted (is that possible) and trans trends skyrocket; big Pharma pays off politicians to pass Universal Basic Income and "free" healthcare and "free" schooling, so people who are working face huge tax hikes to pay for Generation Genderspecial to hang out on campus (or Zoom campus) with blue hair, trading tales of when their surgeries are scheduled.

[–]Shadow_Lurker 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

"free" healthcare

If this pass, it would be the death of north american transgender culture.

When healthcare is public funded most governments tend to be very stingy on what it covers or doesn't cover. For exemple: here where I live we have a public health system which provides SRS and HRT for transgenders, but there's an evaluation period of 2 years 'living as the oposite sex' for eligibility.

While this doesn't sound like much, is important to remember that in the US there's no such thing as 'gatekeeping', so this can be positive on the long run.

[–]our_team_is_winning 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Glad your country has a little bit of gatekeeping for SRS. In the USA, the sort of politicians who would pass those other bills are sadly well on the Trans Train. US govt has long enjoyed racing thru taxpayer money like we have an endless supply.

I still can't believe any doctor, govt funded, private, volunteer, anything, is willing to participate in the Trans Insanity.

[–]ThiccDropkickGay 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

There's so much infighting even among trans groups that it has to implode or collapse at some point. I hope

[–]PeakingPeachEaterfemale♀ | detrans🦎 | eater of peaches 🍑 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Within 5 years...I think (some of) Europe would be more likely to see through the TRA movement than America(if you are talking about USA)--considering some parts of American history(ex. Women were considered property and couldn't vote, black people were treated like crap for years despite being 'liberated', outlawed interracial marriage, etc).

I think it maybe take the USA a bit longer to fully realize the effect of the TRA movement until we make bigger waves here and NOW!

I honestly think the younger generation is more rebellious and most likely won't fall for it as easy, as there is more technology at their fingertips and more information is out there. I think their generation is going to be better than ours(of course, we always hope for them to do better than us!). I've seen mostly the older generations trying to convert the younger ones.

My hope is that the groups like the LGBAlliance can educate others of the TRA movement as well as the importance of helping the LGB--that we're regular people.

I think the goal of movements are...no longer needing them anymore. To the point of where we gain rights and don't really "need" a group, but that may just be a perfect utopia and not necessarily reality.

How can we currently address the issue?

For fellow LGB people going through any mental health issues or discrimination, we should have LGB hotlines for them to chat without any judgement(ex. "I hate that I'm gay/lesbian/bi!!" Don't start armchair diagnosing them with "you have internalised homophobia/biphobia!!" and preach at them. Let them rant/vent and LISTEN. People appreciate being listened to...)

Also, if they consider transitioning, ask them questions!! "Why do you want to transition to a man/woman?" And "How do you feel it will better/worsen your life if you do or do not transition?"

Advise them of the effects it will do to their bodies and how it may further affect their health. Educate them on safe sex. Let them know there are others around if they need somewhere safe to be. We NEED to help eachother if we want to progress!!

Being Lesbian, Gay, or Bisexual is NOT a personality either, it's just..a trait. A trait that won't define their entire identity. Just a "Hey, I exclusively like the same-sex/like both sexes...so how was the baseball game lastnight?".

If we feel lumping the LGB is too general and won't help for each specific letters issues, then create your own groups/find others!

We need people to help with lesbian specific issues.

We need people to help with gay specific issues.

We need people to help with bisexual men issues.

We need people to help with bisexual women issues.

We NEED people to help with LGB issues!!

Those are just some of my thoughts---but like I mentioned---probably not HUGE change or success until we fight/push back drastically. I see the LGBAlliance is fairly new around the world, so all I can say is wait and see AND support them!

Edit: I also wanted to add---tell your straight friends about it!!! I'm sure there are many that are gender critical. Educate them, let them know LGB is separate from the T.

Edit2: Spelling

[–]QueenBread 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

In the next 5 years: probably still going strong.... heck, things might be worse than now on that matter. In the next 20/30 years: I think everyone's going to be ashamed of how they thought mutilating and castrating kids was a-ok. Watch out for all those doing a huge U turn and pretending they totally never supported that trend for years.

[–]Jinera 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think support will get less. In a couple of years more and more people will detransition, from the wave of people who suddenly identified as trans in 2014/2015. Even if the twitter people will ignore this, doctors can't. Its just waiting until people start sueing doctors and therapists for letting them permanently harm their body without properly assessing if there are any other issues/better solutions.

Keep in mind that for a lot of the more mainstream sjw's, the focus on trans people comes from the "black trans lives matter" idea. BLM is an organisation that has gotten a lot of attention before (around 2015) before dying down a little. That will probably happen this time as well. Whether its because people stop caring, or because people start realising there are better organisations out there to support.

The other thing that could happen is that an even more oppressed group will appear, and focus shifts.

[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

In about 10 or so years I see a lot of lawsuits from current transchildren with a lot of physical harm done onto them. Don't know about 5 years though

[–]DoverBeige 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

This is my tin foil hat theory but I'm calling it now. In typical Progressive fashion, by the year 2025 the idea that sex and gender are malleable will have progressed into racial territory. Possessed by their hatred of the race they were cursed to be born with, white liberals will renounce their skin color and all the privileges that come with it and begin to chemically dye their skin and thus the Transracial movement is born! But how does one go along with this ideology without contradicting their past condemnation of cultural appropriation? Black face, after all, is a sin on par with human trafficking! Nay, they will not confine themselves to shades of cream, white, tans, nor browns, but rather will choose to cover themselves head to toe in the bright and vivid color of their choosing. I'm red because I'm passionate! Well I'm yellow because my personality shines like the sun! I'm Green because I love the environment! And not just one race will have been created but many, all shiny and new, unsullied by any previous history of violence or oppression. Brothers and sisters, we are finally free to let our #Truecolors show!

But unforeseen problems begin to form within our newfound master race. With an infinite spectrum of colors to choose from comes infinite races, each one of them claiming to be more oppressed than the other. Why are primary colors so privileged? Why should secondary colors be looked down upon as second class citizens?! Who cares about Black Lives Matters when Teal voices are struggling to be heard? Group and political ideology are blindly assumed based on choice of skin tone, even towards the apolitical, unaffiliated, or apathetic. And what with Donald Trump nearing the end of his second term, all #Truecolor races agree that those who consciously choose to dye their skin in orange hues are consciously supporting a system of sexism, raycism, and bigotry and are an obvious dogwhistle for white supremacists. Our once united and enlightened race is now more divided than ever as colorful mobs wage battle on the streets of large liberal cities in an incestuous tie dye explosion of hate and anger.

Entertained at first, the Cis-races will eventually grow bored and resentful of the loud noises coming from "the stained" and vote Republican.

[–]Tikiri 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think there will be a sizable backlash if and when MtFs are allowed to compete in the Olympics, because the amount of women soundly defeated by natal men will be something no-one can ignore. This won’t be a concern at all when it comes to FtMs because they just won’t win against biological men in sports, unless they’re in a team situation (and even that’s a strong maybe given how a physically weak(er) female could be a possible liability in a male team.

However, I just don’t know how far it can get in an Olympics-level event. For instance, given the fact that there are prominent gay male ice skaters, I can see a scenario where one who suffers from dysphoria will insist on competing as a female ice-skater (those “skirt-go-spinny” costumes will probably be a huuuuge fetish!😂), and if allowed to do so could well leave the female skaters in the dust. A scenario like that will peak a lot of people, i.m.o. Or ... what about gymnastics? That’s another sport which I can see being an extremely fetishistic draw for dysphoric and/or AGP males, due to the tiny, almost childlike size of the female athletes, plus their weirdly sexualized outfits. I can also see MtFs who took puberty blockers arguing that they belong in women’s gymnastics because many (if not most) female gymnasts experience unnaturally delayed puberty. If they’re allowed in, it’s another sport where I can see the males trouncing the female athletes.

Both are scenarios that I can see happening if the males in female sports trend continues, and both will cause some serious outrage, far more i.m.ho. than will males in “rougher” female sports like rugby and MMA fighting ... and those are already raising huge concerns.

But, again, I don’t know how far this stuff will have to progress before people just peak. And given how far it’s progressed already, there’s going to a global situation where federal governments will have to step in to put an end to it. I just hope and pray that won’t take decades (if not longer) to happen.

[–]ThiccDropkickGay 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

When they decided to make objective reality their number one enemy, the writing was on the wall. I only hope they don’t bring gays and lesbians down with them

[–]deliciousdogfoodmy name isnt a puppyplay reference i swear 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

With weak bones and terminal cancer, unfortunately. The fat cats at the top of the big pharma ladder will be well off, though.

It's cigarettes all over again.