all 21 comments

[–]Datachost 23 insightful - 1 fun23 insightful - 0 fun24 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

The medical establishment also agreed lobotomies were the correct path for the mentally ill, to the point the inventor won the Nobel prize for medicine. The medical establishment used to think hysteria was a condition caused by the womb which led to women acting irrational, to which the cure was "stimulators" (and pretty fucking often lobotomies). Way back when the medical establishment thought all of human health was controlled by four humours a belief so widespread that certain stereotypes derived from it still exist today (venting your spleen for example is a saying, because the spleen was thought to be the source of all bile and thus anger). The medical establishment used to believe illness was caused by bad air and ridiculed a doctor who suggested that maybe, just maybe, washing your hands before a delivery could cut down on infant mortality (why it was such an insulting suggestion to practice basic hygiene is anyone's guess). And you could argue all these examples are over a century ago, surely we're more enlightened now. In the last couple of decades pharmaceutical companies pushed pain medication through scrupulous doctors, promising that the drugs were non addictive, we all know how that turned out. Fun fact: the Trevor Project's current CEO has ties to Purdue Pharma.

The medical establishment has been wrong plenty of times before and will likely be wrong plenty of times moving forward. Anyone who says "Well they can't all be wrong" clearly doesn't know how many times they were ALL wrong in the past

[–]LordoftheFliesAmeri-kin 2.0. Pronouns: MegaWhite/SuperStraight/UltraPatriarchy 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The medical establishment has been wrong plenty of times before and will likely be wrong plenty of times moving forward. Anyone who says "Well they can't all be wrong" clearly doesn't know how many times they were ALL wrong in the past

You want to see another way that the medical establishment (with a bit of pushing from the pharmaceutical companies) got it wrong? Thalidomide in the '50s and '60s.

In the US, we came about this close to having a generation or so of babies mutilated by thalidomide. 20,000 American were given the drug as part of trials, but a larger rollout was prevented by, literally, one person in the FDA refusing to sign off on the approvals.

[–]LyingSpirit472 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

(why it was such an insulting suggestion to practice basic hygiene is anyone's guess).

That was apparently said- the reason basic hygiene was so insulting was the belief "being a doctor makes you a gentleman, and a gentleman's hands are always clean- so therefore, making a doctor wash his hands is claiming he's not a gentleman."

[–]IMissPorn 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

What argument? That's the fallacy known as appeal to authority.

[–]jacques1102[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The argument that the majority of medical institution agree that surgery is the best(and only)cure to gender dysphoria and anyone that objects has to be uneducated about the subject with trans issues or crazy to believe in a conspiracy that they all agree on it to make money.While i agree that appeal to authority is bad but people have a different attitude when it comes to majority of scientist or doctors as if the majority have never been wrong in the past.

[–][deleted] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If there is even one (1) detransitioner out there who regrets his or her gender-affirming surgeries, then that proves that said surgery is NOT the best and only cure to gender dysphoria. The fact that there are MANY detransitioners out there especially proves that.

[–]hugged 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Sorry if this is not what you expect or want OP, but whether trans people are happy getting surgery literally does not matter. It's completely irrelevant because no matter how "trans" people feel, TRAs are actively hurting women, gay women, gay men, men who have long hair... anyone who uses a public bathroom...anyone who has an opinion on anything, ever.

Are trans people with crippling dysphoria who get surgery happy? Good for them - but the problem is that in the ideal world for TRAs, you don't need to have surgery, take hormones, or do literally anything to be recognized as trans and enjoy the social privileges, and anyone who disagrees with this sentiment, even a trans person, will be called a transmed and gutted. I remember seeing an abhorrent tumblr post saying "lmao how can terfs think a dude is actually gonna change his outfit pronouns get surgery just to rape a woman in a bathroom, yall dumb" which is a statement that is totally contradictory with what TRAs claim and want. This is why they push for "feminine penis" and "princess wand" because every year "trans rights" further degenerate into accommodating as many future rapists as possible.

Does your tranny making the argument believe that you need dysphoria to be trans? That you need surgery to be allowed into sex segregated spaces? If not they have no point, because the biggest reason why trans rights are wrong (and fundamentally incompatible with society) is precisely because they do not gatekeep AT‌ ALL. My problem with troons isn't that they're getting high on hormone cocktails, chemically castrating themselves, or potentially destroying their bodies with shoddy botched surgeries. The problem is that majority of troons do it for social privileges with zero punishment. There is zero effort required to be "trans" even if changing your legal name takes work because you are still given power over the dirty cishet.

[–][deleted] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

My problem with troons isn't that they're getting high on hormone cocktails, chemically castrating themselves, or potentially destroying their bodies with shoddy botched surgeries. The problem is that majority of troons do it for social privileges with zero punishment. There is zero effort required to be "trans" even if changing your legal name takes work because you are still given power over the dirty cishet.

Excellent point.

[–]proc0 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Same institutions endorsed smoking tobacco, condemned eating healthy fats, advocated for pancakes, bacon, orange juice as healhy, and many more false and incorrect conclusions that ended up hurting millions of people. They all walk in lockstep, and doctors have a little of a cult thing going on, which means it's not hard for them to prioritize their institution and profession over the truth. Then there is the incentive of profit, and we all know people will go to lengths for money, so it's not crazy to think the industry as a whole is making a huge mistake.

[–]iamonlyoneman 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The science is extremely sketchy at best, and the Americanized version takes the worst aspects of the European research and amplifies it.

Also: you are literally not allowed to question orthodoxy in some medical fields. https://archive.ph/3TIAc

[–]Femaleisnthateful 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Many psychologists and clinicians never accepted the 'affirmation' model, and the Dutch Protocol was misapplied from the start. The Tavistock scandal exploded how those concerns were silenced and critics censured.

The same thing is happening in the US but the decentralized, profit-driven model of health care makes it that much more difficult to address.

[–]jet199 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The argument against is it isn't truth.

The American guidelines say constant therapy is needed not just surgery.

Most other countries practice "watchful waiting" not affirmation.

The dutch protocol was based mostly on boys who were gender non conforming from birth, not girls and not kids who suddenly started identifying as trans in adolescence or older.

The best research shows transition masks people less happy and mental health worse. Most other research is junk, they don't follow people up.

[–]VulptexMy pronouns are the/matrix 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

It actually is the best treatment, and it's still not a very good one, hardly a cure. And the fact that they refuse to screen people, to make sure they actually have it before going ahead with all these treatments, should make it clear that they have dubious intentions.

It's just like how some people have suspected the medical industry has or could have the cure for cancer and many other illnesses by now, but they cover it up because they make exponentially more money on the treatments, which also make the patient dependent on them. And in this case they have the added bonus that transgenderism is trendy right now and comes with several political perks.

[–]r2d2_21 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

It actually is the best treatment

In what world is mutilation of healthy organs a good treatment?

[–]VulptexMy pronouns are the/matrix 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

and it's still not a very good one

[–]r2d2_21 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I still don't understand why you think mutilation of healthy organs is a better treatment than therapy.

[–]DirewolfGhost 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Good treatment for society in the long run because they don't procreate.

[–]detaramespez raped me 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Fuck every major medical institution lol

[–]clownworlddropout 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's a highly politicized issue and medical institutions aren't immune to politics. Even the Olympics had to bend the knee to this nonsense. There's nothing holding it up but hot air though, so it's bound to come crashing down eventually. Hopefully sooner rather than later.

[–]fschmidt 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Let God counter it through evolution.

[–]Newzok 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Well yes. And look at where it got the Tavistock clinic. They're being sued by thousands of detransitioners and are being shut down. Lemme see if I can find the article.