Are the TQs right or wrong in saying that the brains of gay people are structured like the brains of their opposite sex by which they mean gay men are psychologically women and gay women are psychologically men?

submitted by EverydayIsSad from self.LGBDropTheT

What most of the articles I have found on google have in common is the idea that the brains of gay women are structured like the brains of straight men and the brains of gay men are structured like the brains of straight women. With those articles, the TQs I've talked to so far have told me they have come to the conclusion gay men are psychologically women for having female brains and gay women are psychologically men for having male brains (aka, 'gay men are just women on the inside' or 'gay women are just men on the inside'). For bisexuals they believe bisexuals have brains that are structured like both straight men and straight women, that their brains are a mixture of the two male brains and female brains and that this makes bisexuals 'gender queer', both men and women on the inside.

Article 1) https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn14146-gay-brains-structured-like-those-of-the-opposite-sex/

The scans reveal that in gay people, key structures of the brain governing emotion, mood, anxiety and aggressiveness resemble those in straight people of the opposite sex.

Article 2) https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/phenomena/2008/06/20/brains-of-gay-people-resemble-those-of-straight-people-of-opposite-sex/

The images show that in the brains of gay people, certain features including symmetry and connections to the brain’s emotional centre are more closely matched to the brains of straight people from the opposite sex.

Using magnetic resonance imaging (MRI), Savic and Lindstrom showed that the brain’s two halves are almost exactly the same size in straight women and gay men. However, both straight men and lesbians had slightly asymmetrical brains, with the right hemisphere being 1-2% larger on the left. These differences only applied to the large cerebrum, which makes up most of our brains. The two halves of the cerebellum, which sits at the brain’s base, were symmetrical in all of the volunteers, regardless of sex or sexual preference.

Earlier studies have found similar results for patterns of brain activity. For example, parts of the brain involved in reward and emotion are more strongly activated when straight men and lesbian women look at female faces, and when straight women and gay men see male faces. The same patterns apply when people smell chemicals that probably act as human pheromones. But attractive faces and enticing pheromones are both related to sex, and responses to them could be learned over time.

And there are many more articles like these two. Do you guys know if there are any scientists that have debunked this "the brains of gay people are structured like the brains of straight people of the opposite sex" idea?

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[–]RedEyedWarriorGay | Male | 🇮🇪 Irish 🇮🇪 | Antineoliberal | Cocks are Compulsory 35 insightful - 2 fun35 insightful - 1 fun36 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

If that is true, that still doesn’t prove that gay men are straight women in the bodies of men, and that lesbians are straight men in the bodies of women. That just proves that homosexuality is not a choice. All it has done is suggest that the source of a person’s sexual orientation lies within the brain. Furthermore, the brain is only one part of the body. As a gay man, I still have testes that produce testosterone, which is a masculine chemical. I still have the same bodily structure other men have. I still have a natural and functioning penis. I still have the Y chromosome that caused me to be male in the first place. In other words, I am still a man. This supposed different structure in my brain is the only thing about me that is different from straight men, and the only effect of that difference is that I like men instead of women.

[–]MezozoicGayoldschool gay 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, and this all rhetorics sounds very homophobic as well: "If you liking other men - you are a woman!". Effectively what they are saying is that homosexuality does not exist, and we all heterosexual, but "in wrong bodies".

[–]joogabahGay shows the way 27 insightful - 1 fun27 insightful - 0 fun28 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

As if they can conclude anything by measuring the size of certain structures in the brain. Our knowledge of the brain is far too rudimentary to make that type of leap. I remember reading criticism of Simon Levay's work which argues something like this. For gay brains they used samples from HIV positive men, or something to this effect. My point is even the selection of who is gay and who is straight is problematic. If they are selecting based on gender stereotypes, who is to say that a lifetime of repeating those specific stereotyped behaviors are the cause and the brain structures the effect, and not the other way around? Neuroplasticity.

[–]Three_oneFourWanted for thought crimes in countless ideologies 18 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 0 fun19 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That is a very good point. If the people they chose all followed a certain pattern in addition to what they say they were testing, then this is 100% a post hoc fallacy that only applies to the EXACT group they tested, and cannot be extrapolated for any meaningful conclusions.

If I tested the color of bears, but only tested in Antarctica, I'd have some results that deviate quite a bit from reality

[–]MezozoicGayoldschool gay 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Best study will be if they will do brain scans of small kids, and then leave scans and wait until kids will grow up. And only after they have grown up, check their kid scans and if there any correlation with who they are now or not.

While current methodology makes little sense: "we took group that is lived in similar way for decades, and found they have some similarities". No shit, Sherlock.

[–][deleted] 25 insightful - 1 fun25 insightful - 0 fun26 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Studies like this are part of what peaked me for a few reasons:

  1. They proved that sexuality is innate, not that some people are 'male-brained' or 'female brained'. When they cite studies like this as 'proof' of transness they admit their own homophobia by implying that gay men aren't 'real' men and lesbians aren't 'real' women because they're same sex attracted. Okay sure, we have proof now that certain brain differences are seen in those attracted to men vs those attracted to women. That says absolutely nothing about gender dysphoria being a product of having an innately male or female brain in a body that doesn't match.

  2. Studies like this only provide insight into the homosexual transsexual type of trans person, i.e homosexuals who transition in order to be 'straight'. This means fuck all for 'eat my boy pussy' gay trans bois and 'suck my girldick' transbians. Because these people are heterosexual.

Gina Rippon didn't necessarily set out to debunk the idea of trans people having opposite sex brain, but her book "Gendered Brain: The New Neuroscience that Shatters the Myth of the Female Brain" compiles various studies to pinpoint if differences do exist and she wasn't able to find anything definitive. Another study 2018 study "Sex Differences in the Adult Human Brain: Evidence from 5216 UK Biobank Participants" says outright

There was considerable distributional overlap between the sexes. Subregional differences were not fully attributable to differences in total volume, total surface area, mean cortical thickness, or height.

You can read it here: https://academic.oup.com/cercor/article/28/8/2959/4996558

Figure 1 shows visually just how much overlap there was between the male and female participants. With this amount of overlap you'd think something like 40-60% of the population would be identifying as trans. But that's not the case.

[–]Seahorse 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Thanks for this.

This study often cited by TRAs but they always cherry pick which aspects to talk about.

I compare it to antivaxxers and the Wakefield study.

[–][deleted] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No problem. And yeah they love to use studies like this in their favor not realizing it actually disproves their argument. Usually what's at play when a study claims to find evidence of brain sex is that the sample size is too small, and when compared to another study with a much larger sample size (over 1000), those differences start to fade. In cases where a large sample size does seem to prove brain sex, TRAs arguing in favor of it always gloss over the fact that TRENDS are found, not something they can definitely look at and say a brain is male or female. Unlike genitals and chromosomes, there is no one structure or even a group of structures in the brain that a scientist can see on a scan and classify its sex. But that's typical TRA behavior really. They see a trend and try to box everyone inside the boundaries. Anyone who doesn't fit is immediately transed.

[–]luckystar 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

IIRC "transbians" (biological men that are attracted to biological women) don't have "female brains" either, just gay men & HSTS. They think these brain studies prove something but all it does is prove that transition is actually a form of gay conversion therapy and that transbians absolutely are not women even by their own twisted standards

[–]MyLongestJourney 17 insightful - 1 fun17 insightful - 0 fun18 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

If only there was such thing as a exclusively male or female brain structure/feature/dimension of structure... We could tell one's sex by evaluating those things.But guess what : There isn't. Male and female brains hugely overlap with very few outliers.

Here is an idea OP : Men and women vary and so do the interests.But society has enforced strict gender roles for milenia.Maybe that gender dysphoria is not the result of a "male/female brain in the wrong body". Maybe it is the result of the clash between one's natural inclinations and those that society pushes as normal to men and women respectively.

[–]MezozoicGayoldschool gay 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Maybe it is the result of the clash between one's natural inclinations and those that society pushes as normal to men and women respectively.

It is not "maybe", it is what gender dysphoria is - plus it has additionaly body dysmorphia symptomes often. Even new wave of trans-theory, which want to dismiss gender dysphoria, and even with dismissing gender dysphoria, they are still focusing on gender stereotypes of the society, same with non-binaries.

And that makes no sense as well. Someone in this sub made a good example some time ago - Imagine you are transwoman pre-op and wearing make-up and dress with high heels, but then you are crossing the border with country that has different gender stereotypes, and there only men wear dresses and make-up and wearing high-heels (and such actually was a period in 1600-1700s in Europe, where it was men's fashion). So now what - by just walking through the border you are no longer transwoman, because you are wearing and looking the most masculine way possible in this society - and you now are not any different from other men around. So you "lost your womanhood" in an instant - just crossing the border made you something else in this coordinate system of beliefs. And it is ridiculous to say the least.

[–]GConly 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

We could tell one's sex by evaluating those things.

You can actually tell someones sex from an MRI with about 95% accuracy. The ones you have trouble with are gay, or autistic females.

[–]MyLongestJourney 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

There is only a handful of studies who claim they achieved that.Most of them from the same teams.They used an AI to look for patterns.Based on individual features you can not tell if a brain is male or female.There is great variation within the individuals.

[–]Q-Continuum-kin 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The issue at hand is that they are implying a directional causality when they don't know and their assumptions go directly against the field of neuroplasticity. Basically that the experience of a person drives the brain structure not the other way around. Cab drivers in NYC will have the same structure. That doesn't mean that they were born to drive cabs only.

[–]reluctant_commenter 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Happy to update this comment if someone has more updated information or sees a mistake.

They are wrong. Those are highly misleading statements at best, and outright fabrication at worst.

Short version: An average gay person's brain is more like that of the opposite sex brain than an average straight person (of the same sex). BUT, this does not mean that it IS a straight person's brain! Or that "a gay man is really a man in a woman's body". That's a gigantic leap based on no facts.

(Also, there may be some volunteer bias in these studies, and overrepresentation of LGB people who have more opposite-sex characteristics.)

The claim about bisexuals all being genderqueer is completely fabricated. Because: a) There is like 0 research on being "genderqueer", period.. even if it were a real phenomenon, there is no evidence upon which to base a comparison between bisexuals and genderqueer-identified people. b) There is little research on bisexuals in the context of brain patterns, anyway!

I think it is no coincidence that both articles you linked are from 2008. The argument that "gay men are just women" and "gay women are just men" has been used to forcibly mutilate and terrorize LGB people in some countries, and pressure LGB youth to come out as transgender.

Also-- it's been 12 years and neuroscience research moves really fast. u/GConly already linked this review of more recent research, but I'll link it as well:

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3180619/

With those articles, the TQs I've talked to so far have told me

I would be very cautious about believing any claims made about biology or "findings on transgender people" in casual articles or media outlets. Not only are most articles lacking citations and correct information, some of the most "groundbreaking" studies supporting popular transgender ideas have been retracted or heavily rewritten, because of major design flaws and shoddy research practices. So you have to be careful and ask yourself, "Ok, what's the evidence for this claim? Does it come from a reputable source, and has the science been replicated?"

[–]florasisHOMOSEXUAL FEMALE/Pussy is my God and I'm monotheist 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Yeah. that's true. It's due due the exposure of testosterone (less for gays and more for lesbian) during the embryonic stage of the brain. Doesn't mean I'm a man, but I got the typical male sexuality. And when they say transwomen got brain similar to real women, they actually talking about study done on effeminate gay dude, homosexual transexuals, who are the ones who have always been very effeminate since childhood, because their effeminate nature come from the womb.

[–]EverydayIsSad[S] 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

Doesn't mean I'm a man, but I got the typical male sexuality

It would mean you got a male brain and you're psychologically a man though (because you think or act like a typical male) ... If that's true then you would be a "male brain in a female body"

[–]florasisHOMOSEXUAL FEMALE/Pussy is my God and I'm monotheist 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I've got a specific sexual characteristic typical of male. The part of sexual arousal is structured the same and works as a normal male, only that specific part. Saying male brain is stupid though. I'm a woman. And even the way I approach sexuality is different than a male, despite both our brain being structured to naturally being aroused by women.

[–]EverydayIsSad[S] 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

If there is no male brain or female brain, then the statement that "the gay brains are structured like the brains of their opposite sex" is false, because there is no typical brain of a female or a typical brain of a male for the brain of a male to be compared to the brain of a female or vice versa

[–]MyLongestJourney 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

but I got the typical male sexuality.

Bam,wham,goodbye madam? Multiple sex partners?

I am very butch,but my sexual habits are not male.

[–]HelloMomo 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I don't know much about the science of this topic, BUT

If that is the case, wouldn't the conclusion be "brain structure doesn't correspond to sex, it corresponds to sexuality"? Y'know, there's no "male brain" but maybe there is an "into males" brain?

[–]KingDickThe2nd 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Going from the research that I have read, the problem with what you say is that not everyone who is gay or lesbian has a brain that is less neurologically stereotypical of their sex, nor is everyone with a less neurologically stereotypical brain gay or lesbian. It is just more statistically likely compared to the rest of the population.

[–]GConly 6 insightful - 4 fun6 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 4 fun -  (8 children)

No they are incorrect.

Despite what radical feminists will tell you, yes you can tell someone's sex from their brain about 95% plus of the time. The tricky brains belong to homosexuals, who are intermediate to both sexes. There's not much difference between a gay man and gay woman.

This matters, because children with gender dysphoria are about 90% gay as adults.

So when the MRI studies were done on people with gender dysphoria in childhood, they were picking up the 'intersexness' of their gay brains, not anything to do with being trans.

A couple of researchers specifically corrected for this, comparing gay trans to gay cis, and heterosexual trans to heterosexual cis.

Turns out that the trans brains were normally sexually developed. What did show up as different was a connective tissue bundle called the IFOF, which was abnormal but only in transwomen, and even then some of them still came into the normal range, mainly in the hetero trans.

The IFOF gets implicated in a lot of mental health conditions, including OCD and anxiety and body image issues.

I'll paste the papers below

New MRI Studies Support the Blanchard Typology of Male-to-Female Transsexualism

T]he brains of both homosexual and heterosexual male-to-female transsexuals probably differ from the brains of typical heterosexual men, but in different ways. In homosexual male-to-female transsexuals, the difference does involve sex-dimorphic structures, and the nature of the difference is a shift in the female-typical direction. If there is any neuroanatomic intersexuality, it is in the homosexual group. In heterosexual male-to-female transsexuals, the difference may not involve sex-dimorphic structures at all, and the nature of the structural difference is not necessarily along the male–female dimension.

As Savic and Arver themselves emphasized, “Contrary to the primary hypothesis, no sex-atypical features with signs of ‘feminization’ were detected in the transsexual group….The present study does not support the dogma that [male-to-female transsexuals] have atypical sex dimorphism in the brain”

Savic also did another paper:

Structural connections in the brain in relation to gender identity and sexual orientation

After controlling for sexual orientation, the transgender groups showed sex-typical FA-values. The only exception was the right inferior fronto-occipital tract, connecting parietal and frontal brain areas that mediate own body perception.

It's also a fact the overwhelming majority of trans never had childhood GD.

A Critique of the Brain-Sex Theory ofTranssexualism 2007

In 2002, the brain-sex theory of transsexualism was seriously challenged by someunexpected findings published by Chung, De Vries, and Swaab. They observed thatsignificant sexual dimorphism in BSTc volume and neuron number does not develop inhumans until adulthood. Most MtF transsexuals, however, report that their feelings ofgender dysphoria began in early childhood. The mostly likely explanation: The Zhou/Kruijver findings reflect the effects of feminizing and masculinizing hormone therapy*

What is odd is that there's psychiatric issue called BIID, where people believe they should be missing a body part or disabled... 19% of them are also transgender, and this is from a time where the rate of trans was one in several thousand in the general population.

[–]MyLongestJourney 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

yes you can tell someone's sex from their brain about 95% plus of the time.

The only studies that have claimed to accomplish this come from a single scientific team,so forgive me if I am skeptical.

[–]florasisHOMOSEXUAL FEMALE/Pussy is my God and I'm monotheist 15 insightful - 5 fun15 insightful - 4 fun16 insightful - 5 fun -  (1 child)

Remember there was a study where 50 percent of woman had "male brain" LMAO

[–]GConly 1 insightful - 4 fun1 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

Which study?

[–]GConly 6 insightful - 4 fun6 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 4 fun -  (1 child)

We'll, I have three here. So this obviously isn't coming from a single team.

Brain Differences Between Men and Women: Evidence From Deep Learning

The proposed 3D CNN yielded a better classification result (93.3%)

Patterns in the human brain mosaic discriminate males from females

Classification accuracy was extremely high [accuracy: 93%, 95% confidence interval (CI) 89.5–94.9%, P < 10−16] and remained significant if head-size-related measurements were excluded [92% (CI 88.9–94.5%), P < 10−16] or regressed out [70% (CI 65.0–74.2%), P < 10−6]. To borrow the framing of Joel et al

Gender Differences Are Encoded Differently in the Structure and Function of the Human Brain Revealed by Multimodal MRI

The multivariate pattern analyses revealed that each of these measures had discriminative power to successfully distinguish between genders (classification accuracy: 94.3%, 90.73%, and 83.89% for GMV, ReHo, and FC, respectively) and their combination further improved the classification performance (96.6%).

Also Savic and Burke's and Ramettis work all accept that you can tell a brains sex, so it seems to be a pretty widely held opinion among neurobiologists.

More work showing brain sex is detectable.

Sex Differences in the Adult Human Brain: Evidence from 5216 UK Biobank Participants

[–]latuspodSuper Straight 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

This all makes perfect sense if you actually think about it. Women and men are different obviously, different interests, different personality traits on average. Of course there are going to be differences in the brain. But if you look at the brain as a whole there will actually be a huge amount of overlap and little difference as well, we are the same species afterall. If you try to say there is no difference between man's brain or a woman's you are like half a step from saying there is no such thing as a woman or a man.

[–]motss-pb 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Determining someone's sex from their brain with 95% accuracy isn't all that impressive. Just by knowing that a person is sexually attracted to men, I can guess that the person is a woman and be right roughly 95% of the time. By knowing a person's height, I can determine their sex with about 83% accuracy.

[–]KingDickThe2nd 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

There's not much difference between a gay man and gay woman.

What is your source for that?

From the articles I read (although this was 5 years ago now, so possibly could be outdated) stated that there was still a gulf in difference between brains of all males and females, but that yes some were more slightly closer in a relative sense. Roughly the equivalent of 2 untouching bell curves.

[–]a_blue_bird 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

As Savic and Arver themselves emphasized, “Contrary to the primary hypothesis, no sex-atypical features with signs of ‘feminization’ were detected in the transsexual group

Later I'll try to find the relevant studies, but there are some that have found male pedophiles to have feminized brain structures. Which is a clear indication that ''feminized regions'' in a male brain is not the same thing as a woman having the same type of ''feminized'' regions in her female brain. If ''feminized'' regions in male transsexuals are found, it needs further study to determine what effects they are having, and not simply assumed that oh well, they must be women then, because 1% of their male typical brain is showing some "feminization" (which itself doesn't even mean female-typical).

Edit: I wrote this because it reminded me that AGP males were also found to have some ''feminized'' regions, but different ones than homosexual males did.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I've heard it explained that brains of lesbians and gays are sort of shifted towards the middle. So there are feminine / masculine aspects to them that are not conforming with their sex, but that is different to saying that they have brains that are very much like or identical to the opposite sex. Interestingly, we know that there is a high correlation (not exact) between gender non-conforming behaviour as kids and homosexuality, so there does seem to be something to it. And there does seem to be gender different behaviour in young kids / babies e.g. girls cry more than boys, girls like pretty things and social play, boys prefer rough and tumble play and to pull things apart to see how they fit together and work.

I think it's worth mentioning though that there aren't massive differences between male and female brains. And then you have complicating factors such as non-neurotypical conditions (e.g. autism, add etc.), and speculation over how much is nature vs. nuture given that girls and boys often lead very different lives. We may know that there are neurological differences between baby girls and boys, but how much of that carries over into their development into adults?

Edit: as a disclaimer I should probably say that I didn't do science in high-school and most of what I know from the topic I learn from google.

[–]insta 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Beware of the I FUCKING LOVE SCIENCETM !!1!^ crowd. They handpick biased findings from abstracts they don't fully understand. Not to mention the field of science can be utterly corrupted by external pressures.

Many political foundations are not based on science and they don't necessarily need to be. People who pretend humans are this completely rational robots are relegated to internet forums.

[–]Eurowoman24 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Ok I need someone to remind me to debunk this another time (endo cramps and all I can't think straight) but the second the woke crowd completely conflate psychology with neurobiology+neuropsychology. Also what's the correlation? if the correlation is less then 0,33 not a strong correlation, results are insignificant. If it's 0,60-1 (1 being the absolute) then that's a stronger theory. Also basing it from a structural stand point alone is weak af, men supposedly (have to double check) have a brain 10% larger then women, by their logic that would mean men are inherently smarter then women.

[–]a_blue_bird 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Do you guys know if there are any scientists that have debunked this "the brains of gay people are structured like the brains of straight people of the opposite sex" idea?

Why are you convinced that this needs ''debunking''? From the studies that I've seen, there are areas of the brain that are more similar to the opposite sex in homosexuals. Obviously we're not speaking of the entire brain, nor exact similarity. I'm leaning to believe that homosexuality is caused by exposure to certain hormone levels in the womb, and there is nothing extraordinary about the same hormone levels affecting the brain more generally than just the regions that determine sexuality. It would seem more extraordinary if the effect was limited to one specific part of the whole organism. I think Blanchard also labelled transsexuality in young gay males/females as ''extreme homosexuality'' or something of the sort.

[–]EverydayIsSad[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Because it just does, it's not a fact that there are areas of the brain that are more similar to the areas of the brain in the opposite sex. It's a hypothesis, and hypothesises can be false and debunked. Even if you're not talking about the entire brain, you're saying a part of the brain of gay people is similar to a part of the brain of their opposite sex. That's how people have come to the conclusion that gay people are psychologically and mentally their opposite sex. And that's ridiculous. You and your "areas of the brains of gay people are similar to areas of the brains of their opposite sex" are not helping gay people, you're pushing things back, making people believe "oh so a gay man is just a woman on the inside? makes sense now"

[–]a_blue_bird 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I don't care about politics (advancing gay rights or whatever) when it comes in conflict with actual empirical research. Also, none of the researchers mentioned in this thread are saying

"oh so a gay man is just a woman on the inside? makes sense now"

[–]EverydayIsSad[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

There's no actual empirical research there, it's just you and those people taking some random data out of nowhere to push your agenda that 'gay men have lady brains'. Lies, damned lies, and statistics. And also, I don't care about empirical research when it comes in conflict with gay rights. The natural conclusion of their so-called research is 'oh so a gay man is mentally and psychologically a woman, makes sense now' even if they didn't say it directly, they implied it.

[–]a_blue_bird 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

There's no actual empirical research there, it's just you and those people taking some random data out of nowhere

So according to you, all those studies have been fabricated? Lol. Ok, keep consulting your crystal ball.

[–]EverydayIsSad[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Of course studies can be fabricated, especially when science is mixed with politics. But eh, if you don't get it, it's not my problem.