all 25 comments

[–]Rakean93Identitarian socialist 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (22 children)

What's really interesting here is that the european right seems to be able to hold some extremly important position, namely indipendence from NATO. I was totally left down when my party, brothers of italy, managed to switch side (i know, a very infamous italian strategy) and support zelensky in the ongoing war. I was upset not only because i know for a fact that the vast majority of the party's base actually sides with russia, but because i was supecting that also the electoral base shared the same feeling, while the society al large was just worried about russian gas. Every poll taken since the war basically confirm my position: 54% of italians oppose sanction against Russia and strongly oppose the idea of sending weapons to ucranians. 20-30% won't answer the question, and only and asbolute minority of about 1/3 is ok with sending small weapons. Literally no one want to send big weapons or direct intervention.

What's the connection with Orban? Orban was able to hold some ground aganist the global-capitalistic left and not cutting every tie with the Russian Federation. He basically was the only right-wing european politician able to see trought the sovereignty lenses which informed the last 10 years of out political history. While i still think that the sovereignty movement was a big win by our side (which i credit mostly to the italian and french radical right, that were able to provide some keyword to the mainstream right), it is not enough anymore. It was never enough. Sovereignty was an useful framework, a gymnasium where to exercise the national auto-determination; but it was wrongly directed againts Europe. In the wake of a multi-polar world, which is now reality despite the histerical screaming of the american deep state, we are now called for a european sovereignty movement. We are tasked with the historical mission of creating an european nation, an european identity and an european state. That cannot happend without multilateralism between Russian, China - and even America. But we should keep in mind that is Russia, and not America, the closest civilization in terms of values, race, religion and history. We should never try to cut Russia outside of Europe, because that would mean total european surrender to the NATO-american empire.

Orban was always a close ally of the italian and french parlamentary extreme right, so we can hope that those parties will adopt the Hungarian stance in the following years. In the wake of re-militarization of Europe, we have yet to see a coherent mainstream nationalist party in Germany: maybe they will be able to study the Hungarian lesson and develope one. But anyway, point is that, despite the obvius needing of our parties to side with Ucraine in that war, there is hope for a europeanist right able to hold his ground against america and against Russia. With enough time we could also hope to integerate the Euroasian union in the UE, if we manage to create an european superstate. But right now we must integrate our heartland countries and get the military we desperately need. While America is retreating from the global stage (as she prepares the fight with China), Europe must step in as the regional superpower. We can't do anything like that if we are plagued with NATO shills. But this election clearly show that a different Europe is possible.

NB: while siding with Le Pen for obvious reasons, i don't think she'll be able to win. But we must not discard Macron so swiftly. If he win, he would be in the political position to advance the project of an european army. That would be a very important milestone for us, expecially since the most americanized european country, England, is no more part of the union.

[–]EthnocratArcheofuturist[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

We are tasked with the historical mission of creating an european nation, an european identity and an european state. That cannot happend without multilateralism between Russian, China - and even America. But we should keep in mind that is Russia, and not America, the closest civilization in terms of values, race, religion and history. We should never try to cut Russia outside of Europe, because that would mean total european surrender to the NATO-american empire.

I agree 100%.

With enough time we could also hope to integerate the Euroasian union in the UE, if we manage to create an european superstate.

I disagree. Why would we want countries like Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan to join us? They're not European.

[–]Rakean93Identitarian socialist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They are not, but Russians are European. And a closer cooperation between the European Union and the Eurasian Union will obviously benefit the European core.

[–]NeoRail 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

The EU cannot be reformed. Any EU centralisation now would be counter-productive.

[–]Rakean93Identitarian socialist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

I don't like to entertain in such hypothesis because they are basically fantasy fiction. I would like an Aryan Imperium of Europe as much as any other guy in this forum, but it's not going to happen: we don't have neither the revolutionary force neither the material conditions for make it happen. We must be grounded in the reality, and the reality is that we have an European institution and we have the ability to do something within this framework. Retreating from this task doesn't mean building something new and better, but giving all the power to our enemies. Nor I consider viable maintaining the nation state decentralised European architecture. It's just a matter of pragmatism.

[–]NeoRail 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (17 children)

Pragmatism is good, but it should still be pragmatism for something. I do not think the EU can be anything other than a liberal monopoly. The structure of the EU is such that without taking control of every EU institution and every national government, political change will remain impossible.

[–]Rakean93Identitarian socialist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

The structure of the EU is at best extremely complicated, but that's not an excuse. In fact, the EU is right now basically blocked by a two countries axis (Poland and Hungary) with incredibly tiny population and GDP. That's just to say, it's not only the left able to exploit the structure of the EU. It will be probably be reformed in the future.

[–]NeoRail 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

In fact, the EU is right now basically blocked by a two countries axis (Poland and Hungary) with incredibly tiny population and GDP.

I am sure you see the problem with reforming the EU along nationalist lines, then?

[–]Rakean93Identitarian socialist 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

Yes, there are problems. It's still easier to build up something despite those problems than trying to destroy everything and rebuild it up. Europe is still remarkably European, racially speaking, and the vast majority of the population, after Brexit, is Catholic. I think that's a solid ground to build up something.

[–]NeoRail 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

But this isn't just any problem, this is a glaring, critical issue with any anti-liberal, pro-EU position. What the demographics of Europe are is completely irrelevant - the USA was also 90% white and overwhelmingly Protestant in the 1960s. Political action depends on an entirely different set of factors, and the EU is one of them, acting as a dead end.

[–]Rakean93Identitarian socialist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

USA had from the very beginning the problem of the niggers. Now please note, i'm an identitarian, i'm not a biological racist nor a racial realist nor an IQ enthusiastic, and i know that i'm basically alone on this forum. I embrace the position of alain de benoist. The problem is not the presence of a minority group, the problem is inability to integrate it - also racially. It is very clear, for me, that the USA were heading to the social collapse (which doesn't imply the state cllapse) since the moment they decided to not integrate niggers nor to give them full indipendence - i'm speaking of an autonomous state -, but rather to segretate them. In fact, right now america only struggle with groups that wasn't able to integrate, mostly the blacks (i think that latinos and asians will receive a white pass in the next 50 years or so, if nothing else change). So i think that Europe is in a right position to start the process of european integration, beeing mostly homogeneus and not having segregated minorities.

I apologize if i wasn't on spot on the reply. I'm re-reading your comment right now, and i understand that you think that there is something inherently bad in the architecture of the Union, but it's the goal of the political action to correct what's bad. I think that an european nationalism is here and is pretty strong even in the left - if anything, the problem will be to persuade to switch the right from national sovereignty to european sovereignty. I switch on the tv everyday in the wake of the conflict and basically everyone is asking for the same thing: less NATO, more europe. Europe must take care for herself, since we are not always in the boat as america. I think that's a nationalistic drift, both from left and right, similar to trumpian one in America. I mean, Trump at the end of the day wasn't realle able/willing to do what he promised, but the 2016 program was pretty on spot.

i'm not here to defend the EU. I know it was pretty wild on a lot of stuff i don't like, neoliberism and gay propaganda mostly. But that's nothing structural. Those are just political positions that we can change.

[–][deleted]  (6 children)

[deleted]

    [–]EthnocratArcheofuturist[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    not a biological racist nor a racial realist

    What? Why?

    [–]NeoRail 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

    I support Pan-Europeanism too, but the EU is the exact antithesis of authentic Pan-Europeanism. I am not sure how you can say that it should be corrected, when such a thing is completely impossible. In order to achieve such a thing, right wing Pan-Europeanists would need to control all of Europe simultaneously, and at that point the existence of the EU itself would be irrelevant.

    [–]Three_Rainbow_Dildossocks alts: boobiebrother, crustybutt, dingoatemytaco, schizoid 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

    Great results. This election and the coming French one coming in a few days actually had me bothered. Seeing six parties, including the now Jew'd up Jobbik, complete with a Jewish leader, which at this point we may as well call 'Jewbik', team up to oppose Orban seemed a formidable threat.

    With Greece's Golden Dawn dismantled and Jobbik practically hijacked and then placed into some lame pro-EU anti-Orban coalition, we can see that the System/Left have been working as hard to crush us there as anywhere else.

    But Fidesz actually looks to have gained seats and voting share. While the globohomo filth, particularly Jobbik and MSZP, have hilariously lost seats.

    Maybe this result does make sense: I can't imagine MSZP voters being fine with voting for an alliance that includes Jobbik (which, counter to reality, they would still see as Far-Right). Likewise, some Jobbik voters who still haven't switched to Fidesz or to 'Our Homeland' have probably received a rude awakening knowing that their party is now in an alliance with the direct descendant of the Communist Party.

    I hope that this will convince this globohomo party alliance to break up, rendering them even less capable of ever retaking power.

    I'm glad that 'Our Homeland' gained seats without harming Fidesz. Obviously I prefer them over Orban/Fidesz, but Hungary cannot afford to divide the sane voters lest the totally crazy parties, whose only unifying idea is 'Orban bad', get power only to implode into an infight from which only globohomo would benefit.

    [–]EthnocratArcheofuturist[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    What happened to Fidesz and Jobbik is an almost total inversion. Fidesz used to be a typical (((cuckservative))) party that was basically center-right/liberal on most issues. Jobbik on the other hand was a genuine ethnonationalist party. Now, they seem to have switched places. It truly is remarkable what happened there. You never see this kind of inversion happen on the right. It's unique to Hungary.

    [–]Three_Rainbow_Dildossocks alts: boobiebrother, crustybutt, dingoatemytaco, schizoid 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Fidesz is still philosemitic and rather CivNat, but they indeed certainly aren't the 'liberal democratic' group they were in the 1990s, who were essentially just about anti-Communist / pro-liberal / pro-integration with Western Europe. Orban literally still accuses Jobbik of being 'anti-Semitic' and 'Far-Right', the latter being particularly strange when Fidesz seems to be further Rightward of them now.

    Jobbik is the one that really astounds me, since it only took them a decade to transform totally into a pro-System, pro-globohomo liberal party. From ethnonationalist to having a Jewish leader. Furthermore, I don't really know the specifics of what happened, only that Gabor Vona's 'leadership' was basically responsible for the strong Leftward shift to bring them from Far-Right to near Centre. The actual Far-Right people in Jobbik left, meaning that the useless centrists now thoroughly control the party. They still make a bit of noise about 'patriotism', but they're totally for integration into globohomo institutions. Furthermore, a huge amount of what they put out is essentially just anti-Fidesz, anti-Orban propaganda.

    I have no idea whether this decline was self-inflicted through incompetence and stupidity—in which case it was an exceptional and highly unusual failing—or whether the EU, etc. and their sympathizers within Hungary simply made a coordinated attempt to hijack their party before it would start seeing alliances with Fidesz/KDNP as beneficial and therefore strengthening Orban. In which case they were remarkably successful.

    One thing is for certain: 2022 Fidesz is better than 1998 Fidesz; 2022 Jobbik is far worse than 2012 Jobbik.