Response to Kevin Drum's article about race and IQ

submitted by Fourth_stage from self.debatealtright

Here’s Why the Black-White IQ Gap Is Almost Certainly Environmental https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2019/06/heres-why-the-black-white-iq-gap-is-almost-certainly-environmental/

response:

https://medium.com/@cremieux/resolute-ignorance-on-race-and-iq-courtesy-of-kevin-drum-d9cbf930f7db https://archive.vn/NdCzf

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[–]GConly 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I've not got a lot of faith in the first article (all environment) because it put this:

Modern humans migrated into Europe about 40,000 years ago.

The joy of having a bio anth degree is that I know the date modern humans exited Africa was about 120k ago. Modern humans were in Australia by 50k ago and a significantly differentiated group back migrated into north Africa 30k ago (Mt DNA type U, found in EUP remains 35k old.

So the separation of Africa and non African populations was a very long time ago.

It's also stunning just how fast evolution has been shown to happen since the Neolithic. Even just a few thousand years would be enough to cause an SD variance with no need to evolve new mutations, if a new environment needed more brain power.

Also, everyone attempting to support the environment as cause try to hide this fact: NONE OF THE SCARR ROWE STUDIES IN ADULTS OF DIFFERENT RACES AND SES FIND ANY EVIDENCE POVERTY IS CAUSING LOWER IQ IN THE WEST.

[–]Girondin 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Wikipedia links a study that came out a month after this mother jones piece that found modern humans in southern Greece 210,000 years ago. That claim that modern humans "came to europe 40,000 years ago" need correction in that it represents a major wave, you would think were no modern humans in Europe prior to 40,000 years ago or out of Africa prior to 65,000 years ago which I used to think was the case.

[–]GConly 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Nice find. Although morphology is a bit imprecise, I remember one very old set of north African remains that were bickered over for decades. Neanderthal, AMH, third party.. lots of ground for debate. Too old to recover DNA from this lot though.

Jebel Irhoud, IIRC.

That claim that modern humans "came to europe 40,000 years ago" need correction in that it represents a major wave

It was the wave that took out the Neanderthals.

People have to remember they were human too. We interbred with them, we have a lot of thier genes for colouring and environmentally relevant genes too. We would have interacted and traded with them.

It's entirely possible the site in the article shared traits because we were "mingling" across the Med area with them. More gene flow than a population movement.

[–]Girondin 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Does this cremieux guy have a twitter? Literally never heard of this guy, It's pretty hilarious the difference between the pieces, one has a solid grasp of quantitative genetics, psychometrics, factor analysis and is dense with equations (the response) while the other is just a tiny article (motherjones piece) making strong claims.

[–]rayznack 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

He's now unfortunately inactive on reddit, but was a serious and prolific hbd poster. His ideology is closest to absolute neo-reaction/dark enlightenment. Just to be clear - and to get this in front of anyone thinking this would be some rebuttal against the person - he says he's of the Tribe which he also mentions in one of his Medium articles. I'm unaware of any blog and in fact he has said outside medium he didn't have one. I'm happy to reveal his reddit handle in pm to some users but won't reveal publicly.

Closest twitter accounts on par with cremieux would be humanvarieties but they aren't active on twitter. Seems they are now weekly posting over at their site, however.

[–]Fourth_stage[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Hey rayznack, hows going?

[–]rayznack 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I'm well. Unironically learning to code. You?

[–]Fourth_stage[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Made a telegram channel, posting stats there, trying to arm our guys with useful information any way i can

[–]SaidOverRed 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It isn't this hard. And holy crap both sides could use some conciseness.