That’s why there can be no losing for the West in Ukraine. To the Mackinderists at the top of the power structures in London, Washington D.C. and Brussels, losing Ukraine means losing the entire world, because they have this very-outdated view of world geography.

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[–]SoCo 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (12 children)

That makes no sense due to Putin having no interest in conquered Ukraine. West Ukraine has been fighting East Ukraine since before 2014. Russia got pissed that everyone began ignoring it and its atrocities to Ukrainians with Russian heritage.

[–]Dune1032 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

No. Putin wants all of Ukraine because Ukraine was once part of Russia.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

You should check out the history of Ukraine during the World Wars, and prior. You'd see how ridiculous that is to say.

(and not just the mostly defaced Wikipedia page)

[–]Dune1032 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Britain and France gave Hitler the Sudetenland hoping it would appease him. It didn't. He next annexed all of Czechoslovakia. Then he claimed that the Polish Corridor belonged to Germany. Putin will not stop with East Ukraine.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Putin only entered office in 2012, so your association of Hitler's actions and intentions, in correlation with projections of you think Putin may personally want, doesn't make much logical or historical sense.

Even though Russia is not the Soviet Union, you might be interested in the slight-irony of your position, considering the Soviets occupied Ukraine, then Nazis overtook it (or parts of it), which some called liberating it, but then the Soviets later took it back once again. When the Soviet Union collapsed, Ukraine declared independence. Ukraine was, even more so than now, largely made of a Soviet speaking and a Soviet heritage population. Many Soviet-Ukrainians left to Russia to help rebuild from the collapsed Soviet Union and constitute an integral part of Russia. Of course, today, the number of Russian speaking Ukrainian and with Russian heritage, is still significant.

Which lead's to 10 year long war...

Later, Moscow vowed to protect the Russian-speaking people of Crimea when Ukraine chose Russia's over the US/UK financial deal in 2014 and suddenly Ukraine was a war zone of civilian protesters, mercenaries, and suspiciously lots of US/EU involvement. Regardless of what anyone thinks, it seems Moscow determined the Ukrainian revolution was a US/EU ruse and a coup with a cover story, in violations of previous US, UK, and Russia treaties with Ukraine to disarm their nuclear weapons (Soviet leftovers from after the World Wars), this is when they annexed Crimea.

Half of Ukraine also didn't seem to support the new leadership or circumstances of it unfolded, creating a deep divide int he people and sparking a 10 year long war of US/EU-supporting East Ukrainians and Russia-supporting East Ukrainians bombing and warring with each other. The war killed many thousands of Ukrainians, destroyed much of East Ukraine, littered their country with land mines, and caused several near continent-wide environmental disasters due to bombing areas with mines, which have water pumps that must be maintained, including one with nuclear waste sealed in it.

With Ukraine, the US, and EU openly and publicly talking of supporting Western Ukraine's intentions to make an offensive slaughter of Eastern Ukraine for the last 5 or 6 years, Russia went to Geneva with concerns of a coming genocide of the Russian-speaking Ukrainians and again vowed to protect them.

Geneva laughed at them and our media ran stories ridiculing Putin's worry of genocide. Not surprisingly, Russia began the current military action in response, presumably taking matters into their own hands.

[–]Dune1032 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Hitler claimed that the people in the Sudetenland wanted to be part of Germany. France and Britain let Hitler have the Sudetenland thinking this would appease Hitler. Instead, Hitler took over all of Czechoslovakia. This is similar to Putin claiming that the people of East Ukraine want to be part of Russia.

If half of Ukrainians don't like the government, they would not be fighting so ferociously. The UN has condemned Russia for invading Ukraine. If Russia has a grievance against Ukraine, it should take it before the UN.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Russia took their concern for the Russian speaking Ukrainian people before Geneva, in the proper manor the UN would have wanted, following long standing treaties. Russia literally took the submissive approach and cooperated with the US/EU as if a member......they were laughed at and ridiculed for their concerns of genocide in their neighboring country, many against Russian blood relations.

Our US and EU leaders had been publicly boasting about preparing West Ukraine for an offensive to finally finish off East Ukrainians any year now, for the last five years. Evil colonist countries never change, especially with such high levels of corruption in charge.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

That makes no sense due to Putin having no interest in conquered Ukraine.

At the start of the war there was a definite invasion targeting Kyiv: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64664944, and the prematurely released press release describes Ukraine as returned to Russia as Belarus is: https://russiaukraineinvasion.com/russias-view-the-empire/premature-victory-article/

West Ukraine has been fighting East Ukraine since before 2014.

Not exactly. Russia has been fighting in East Ukraine since annexing Crimea in 2014.

Russia got pissed that everyone began ignoring it and its atrocities to Ukrainians with Russian heritage.

According to Russian propaganda, but not to history: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accusations_of_genocide_in_Donbas

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

What you are recounting is misleading propaganda that intentionally frame the history too short.

When the Soviet Union collapsed, Ukraine declared independence. Ukraine was, even more so than now, largely made of a Soviet speaking and a Soviet heritage population. Many Soviet-Ukrainians left to Russia to help rebuild from the collapsed Soviet Union and constitute an integral part of Russia. Of course, today, the number of Russian speaking Ukrainian and with Russian heritage, is still significant.

Which lead's to today's 10 year long war...

Later, Moscow vowed to protect the Russian-speaking people of Crimea, when Ukraine chose Russia's over the US/UK financial deal in 2014 and suddenly Ukraine was a war zone of civilian protesters, mercenaries, and suspiciously lots of US/EU involvement. Regardless of what anyone thinks, it seems Moscow determined the Ukrainian revolution was a US/EU ruse and a coup with a cover story, in violations of previous US, UK, and Russia treaties with Ukraine to disarm their nuclear weapons (Soviet leftovers from after the World Wars), this is when they annexed Crimea.

Half of Ukraine also didn't seem to support the new leadership or circumstances of it unfolded, creating a deep divide int he people and sparking a 10 year long war of US/EU-supporting East Ukrainians and Russia-supporting East Ukrainians bombing and warring with each other. They failed multiple peace treaties the world urged them to make, hoping to stop Ukraine from killing its self. The war killed many thousands of Ukrainians, destroyed much of East Ukraine, littered their country with land mines, and caused several near continent-wide environmental disasters due to bombing areas with mines, which have water pumps that must be maintained, including one with nuclear waste sealed in it.

With Ukraine, the US, and EU openly and publicly talking of supporting Western Ukraine's intentions to make an offensive slaughter of Eastern Ukraine for the last 5 or 6 years, Russia went to Geneva with concerns of a coming genocide of the Russian-speaking Ukrainians and again vowed to protect them.

Geneva laughed at them and our media ran stories ridiculing Putin's worry of genocide. Not surprisingly, Russia began the current military action in response, presumably taking matters into their own hands.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Of course, today, the number of Russian speaking Ukrainian and with Russian heritage, is still significant.

Which lead's to today's 10 year long war...

Not it didn't. Russians and Ukrainians had no conflict in Ukraine.

What least to the war is invasion by Russia.

Regardless of what anyone thinks, it seems Moscow determined the Ukrainian revolution was a US/EU ruse and a coup

"Moscow determined".

The desire to move politically and economically towards the democracy and rule of law of the EU and away from the autocracy and oligarchs of Russia was not only the popular desire in Ukraine, it's also blatantly obvious why. They suffered from corruption, and suffer from it still.

Russia went to Geneva with concerns of a coming genocide of the Russian-speaking Ukrainians and again vowed to protect them.

There was no such genocide for the people in Ukraine. Only if you listen to the Russian state media.

They had peace until the Russian invasion.

https://twitter.com/HannaLiubakova/status/1498366887683624962?t=Sg3mvzwqNDrLc3znPp5CFQ&s=19

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I'm sorry, but you are wrong. There hasn't been peace in Ukraine for ages. Most of us remember this, but it seems that propaganda about the current incursion hopes you do not.

Casualties of East v West Ukrainian war "Russo-Ukrainian War"
Casualties from April 2014 to February 2022 (before the recent Russian intervention)
Ukrainian Civilians 3,404 killed
Foreign Civilians 306 killed
Western Ukrainian Government (US/EU recognized) [Ukrainians]
(Led by Zelenskyy as of 2019)
National forces 4,400 killed
National forces volunteers 4,647 killed
Eastern Ukrainian separatist rejecting the post-violent take-over government [Ukrainians]
(People's Militia of the Donetsk People's Republic and People's Militia of the Luhansk People's Republic)
Ukrainian civilian militias 6,517 killed

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russo-Ukrainian_War

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Casualties_of_the_Russo-Ukrainian_War

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You're right that there were deaths from the Russian sponsored invasion, including civilian deaths.

What there wasn't was attacks on Russian speaking civilians.

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

All the deaths listed were from Ukrainians fighting Ukrainians, before the Russian intervention. Most of us remember this, it was huge issue for a long time and many countries tried to get them to cease fire, but both sides would quickly break every agreement.

Yes, the Ukraine military is attacking East Ukraine, which is the Russian speaking Ukrainian area.

Actually, when you know the history of Ukraine, especially through the last two world wars and rebuilding after, then you know that a large portion of Ukraine is ethnic Russian-Ukrainians....the portion under constant conflict with the other half of Ukraine for the last decade, of which the US has been openly planning to help extinguish with talk of offensive attack, prompting Russia's concern about genocide.