Fall of liberalism: we are doomed to Byzantium?

submitted by Rakean93Identitarian socialist from self.debatealtright

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[–]Wrangel 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The US has declined from 50% of global gdp post wwii to 16% of global gdp today. Russia isn't going to defeat the west or liberalism, it is going to be a combination of many factors. The rise of China, India, Pakistan, Vietnam, turkey, gulf states, Iran, etc. provides a large illiberal block. A Kenyan diplomat said that when China visits they get a hospital, when the UK visits they get a lecture.

The developing countries are tired of the meddling of the west. They don't want trade deals that are full of rules and constraints imposed on them. They are treated like children by the US and they are tired of it. Even Saudi Arabia has sour relations with the US. They are fed up with being bossed around with and pretty much everything they need can be bought from China.

Keeping a global empire together is difficult and when other countries increasingly have a will of their own and modern weapons it becomes increasingly difficult to bully the rest of the world into submission.

Another big factor is the decline of the imperial core. The west is declining in iq, there is far more corruption in the west than there was before, diversity is ruining institutions and we are increasingly struggling to keep things going.

Liberalism will increasingly fall apart as local leaders develop a stronger will of their own and deal with each other rather than liberal institutions.

[–]NeoRail 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I don't know about Pakistan, but to my knowledge India is very much a liberal state. The only thing special about it is its non-aligned foreign policy.

[–]EthnocratArcheofuturist 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I wouldn't call Modi a liberal.

[–]ifuckredditsnitches_Resident Pajeet 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Domestically he is absolutely an egalitarian leftist in the same line as people like Mandela, MLK, and crucially in the Indian context, Ambedkar. He has massively increased gibs and affirmative action for all minorities beyond any previous administration of any ideological character. He has done very little on the other hand to actually further the demographics who actually vote for him and maintain Indian society at large.

However at the same time India doesn't really align within the same foreign policy block as the liberal US either, given India's inclinations towards Russia, Iran, and historically even Palestine. To be honest I think Modi personally wants to realign towards the US/Israel just based on some of the statements his party has done but the bureaucratic inertia within India is too far within the orbit of Russia to effectively do so.