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[–]radicalcentristNational Centrism[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Sure, you have more pressing challenges under these conditions. Some centuries ago, Europe experienced similar conditions, but still had more breakthrough inventions. Hence, I agree with you to some degree, but believe you are somewhat oversimplifying the situation.

Without having IQ Test information from thousands of years ago, I think it's entering dangerous territory to compare intelligence levels of people from the past with that of the present. In fact, it creates many contradictions. For example, lets pretend that ok, Europeans were always geniuses and they had a IQ of 100 or more. Why would IQ levels ever improve at all, especially when education, sanitation, public nutrition have all gotten dramatically better over the years? Even notorious IQ scientists like Richard Lynn admitted as much when he compared test scores of East Germans in 1992 and in 1998, and found differences as big as 50% when Germans were freed from Communism. https://lesacreduprintemps19.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/roivainen.pdf And I don't like using Lynn as a reference, because he is an extremely dishonest researcher (i.e, he was once caught using the scores of disabled Spanish children and writing them in for African countries). But back on topic, East Germans can't be dumber than their own ancestors given the type of development that still existed (cars, jets, assault rifles. They didn't regress into Cavemen...)

Obviously, our media talks more about the situation here and thus, we often do not hear about African inventors. I am not sure, why you think, this should be impossible for Africans. An average does not mean, that everyone has the same skills.

When the media prefers to show the worst parts of the third world , it creates a self perpetuating image that they have no hope or that they can't look after themselves. You don't see the media trying to cover Japan by showing only their worst slums for example. In regards to averages, the same IQ studies literally say that entire African countries fall far below mental retardation. Even that one example of the child living in poverty but building a windmill should raise eyebrows. How do we know what life is really like when I explained the media already has a huge bias against documenting these success stories? There could very well be many more African inventors out there, but the current obstacles of war and media bias make it hard to observe from afar.

Yes, I fully agree with this. That's why I said "assuming [...] there are no important side effects of those genes". Sure, 100% certainty will probably never exist, but there might be a point at which we are certain enough to accept the situation.

Fair enough.

This is a serious threat, but not the system I advocate for. I advocate for becoming the President myself or at least have someone leading the country, who broadly shares my views. Sure, some evil guy might take control of the government and commit such horrible crimes, but this situation exists in every society. Even in the most liberal state, some bad guy might take power, change the laws and start committing genocide. I invite you to help us creating a system, that tries to prevent the takeover by horrible people.

Fair enough.

Every society needs some rules. Someone has to make the decision. Even if some actions are subjective or even outside our control (what I do not think). even then you need some rules. Some biological determinist might believe some people will kill others anyways. Even if this were right (and I highly doubt this), even then I do not see any good reason, why we should not imprison the killer. Sure, in this scenario it is not his fault, but he still is a danger to the rest of society.

Punishing people that murder is fair. Evaluating the system that hands out these sentences is worth looking into. For example, if an Elite group decides life in prison is a fair sentencing, but science says that is not necessary to maintain a safe society, who do we trust? And even when shown the evidence and the Elite group reject calls to change the justice system, what then? You can start to understand my process of why healthy skepticism is always important, even in situations where another group believes all their actions are meant to keep society safe.

Interesting question. China was once the world's leading nation, but stagnated for centuries due to too much homogeneity, especially with regards to speech. So no, I do not believe that anyone should get imprisoned for being a liberal, a conservative or whatever. His genes should not be changed. The only exception would be, if someone advocated for ending our own people. Then he might need a gene alteration, because this sounds like a serious mental illness. Ending here does not mean genocide in the sense of killing (this would be advocating for violence and thus a crime anyways), but more like saying everyone has to mix with foreigners, so that our genes are bred away.

This may be a hard pill to swallow, but what if the majority of humans will always carry the genes for race mixing or diversity? Genetic purity was never really a thing for the millions of years human ancestry stretches back. Of course, there's nothing stopping the Alt-right from still trying to remove it, but think back to what I said about nature giving these traits a purpose. Race mixing could have lead to something advantageous, such as inheriting the minds of Neanderthals that is now found in Human DNA. There is also a such thing as hybrid vigor, which is meant to counter the effects of interbreeding. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosis

Of course, I understand the opposite arguments exists as well. Race mixing could present dangers to lowing IQ or making bone marrow transplants more difficult. Ultimately, you are taking a 50:50 chance with these removing genes.

[–][deleted]  (6 children)

[deleted]

    [–]radicalcentristNational Centrism[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

    I might have phrased this poorly. I would not alter the genes of someone engaging in race mixing. I was talking about racial self-hatred to such a high amount, that one wants to forcefully mix everyone else. This guy would be the problem, but not random guy dating an Asian girl or whomever.

    That's a fair point. I think the connection to racial self-hatred may actually be tied to self esteem issues. After all, people find many reasons to hate themselves and desire making changes about it. They may hate their hair, hate their nose, hate their body weight etc. Maybe the solution isn't even genes at all, but promoting an environment where people are not ashamed of themselves? It reminds me of those studies on women identity. Women aren't born to think less of themselves, but when they're exposed to media that pushes for a certain [unrealistic] standard, there's a high correlation of teenage girls trying to lose weight or vomit themselves into staying thin. Could probably make a similar argument for race. It's not genes that causes someone to hate other people, but behavior that was learned?

    [–][deleted]  (4 children)

    [deleted]

      [–]radicalcentristNational Centrism[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

      I disagree here. Take fat people as an example. Should we encourage them to keep eating unhealthy? No, quite the contrary. We should encourage them to live more healthy.

      The truth is somewhere in-between. We shouldn't encourage people to junk themselves on food, but studies have also shown anti-fat campaigns have actually made obese people more likely to stay obese. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6565398/

      Yes, it is most probably learned behavior. So how would I solve these self esteem issues? Well, I am open to all kinds of ideas. Should we nudge people into behaving better? Should we shame them for bad behavior? Might some sort of "positive" social credit system be the answer? I do not know, but I definitely want to help my fellow people to live more healthy and solve their issues.

      I'll admit I haven't actually researched this topic in complete detail so don't treat this advice as being factual. But my solution for self esteem stems from improving the family structure. I look at Asian societies and I'm always impressed by the fact they are incredibly tight knit. They're not divorcing in huge numbers, their children always have access to some form of education or private tutor, it's very common to see children live with both their parents and grandparents. It's honestly the perfect model that ensures some kind of community happiness. And I just want to point out I don't think this family structure is linked to IQ. Everywhere on the entire Asian continent, you will see this type of community success. Israel, Palestine, Saudi Arabia, India, Philippines, Thailand, Japan, China, South Korea, Pakistan. At the family level, all ethnic groups from this continent seem to understand the importance of looking after their own family and trying to ensure they're all happy.

      There is a major criticism to make about Western culture. The family unit has indeed been destabilized. Hyper individuality and perhaps feminism has lead to a bit of social rot when people treat having family as a commodity, instead of as a serious requirement for civilization. Regaining that nucleus I think is key to ending self hatred. Because brother and sister, or mother and father, they wont have knives pointed at each others back, waiting to betray them at any moment.

      Again, this is just my opinion that I haven't quite fact checked to see if everything has a scientific basis or not.

      [–][deleted]  (2 children)

      [deleted]

        [–]radicalcentristNational Centrism[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

        I once again fully agree. The big question is, how do we restore the family? Do you know a bit more about these Asian countries? Sure, some of them are quite religious, but do you know some details?

        That's something I have to read up on. Sorry, I wish I had the immediate answer to this question. At best, I've come across the occasional news article going into detail about "multigenerational homes" and how Indians have had massive success with this tactic. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-54053091

        Which is not surprising, because it has lead to them having the highest income of any group in America.

        https://gulfnews.com/world/americas/indians-in-america-make-100000-on-average-highest-earning-ethnic-group-1.1569215954674