all 54 comments

[–]x0x7 30 insightful - 3 fun30 insightful - 2 fun31 insightful - 3 fun -  (19 children)

I've seen this on so many alternatives when there is a migration. The initial influx leads to posts around that time getting many votes. When the majority leave or forget about the site, the new posts can't compete.

It creates a rather ironic situation where as they do trickle back they see the same posts they saw when the were here and say, oh, the site is dead, doesn't have enough content, I'm going back to Reddit. Meanwhile we literally have new content on /new that isn't going anywhere, and we have more content on days when there were fewer users.

The solution is to browse /new and upvote things.

It would be interesting to try to solve the problem of inconsistent user flow.

Idea: On days where the average posts's age is above X amount, cause there to be highlighting on the /new link, to encourage people to go there.

[–]brightlightbellend 10 insightful - 7 fun10 insightful - 6 fun11 insightful - 7 fun -  (13 children)

Tried browsing new, felt like wading through sewage. Using the FOSS app, so no way of blocking saidits. If I see one more ice_posiedan spam, I won't be held accountable for my actions.

[–]x0x7 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

That's one of the reasons why I never trust any post I make to be seen here, even though it will be seen on almost any other site, even if I know the content is good. We have almost no /new browsers because people don't want to wade through the ice_posiedan.

If we just make /all/new block the same way as /all, the site would take off. People post ultimately to be heard. The post fail rate here is higher than reddit's and that's saying something.

Like I feel there is no point in posting high effort content because it will just go to waste. Which is ironic because the culture here is more high effort. I'd like my higher effort posts to go here... but there is a 75% chance it will go nowhere, and with enough experience I've figured out it's not the quality of the post. It's just random.

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

/u/magnora7 is ready to pull the trigger on this change, keep bugging him and maybe make a post about it.

[–]magnora7 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

This feature is up to you, d3rr. I'll let you decide, I'm on the fence about it now, and I can see both sides of the argument to add this feature or not add it

[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

it's a tough one but this guy made a good argument about how it cripples people trying to updoot in /s/all/new and thus maybe the whole site.

How about we start small and add a blurb to that one listing only about how you should click 'mute sub' if you are seeing too much of a sub you don't care about?

I verified that IP2 and GC still appear and are searchable on the https://saidit.net/subs pages. So if we do want a full disappearance from /s/all they are still kinda publicly here.

[–]magnora7 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

How about we start small and add a blurb to that one listing only about how you should click 'mute sub' if you are seeing too much of a sub you don't care about?

Okay that sounds like a great and easy solution. I'd be 100% down for that. Just right above the first listing or something. Not sure the best way to accomplish though in the code though.

I don't mind them being on the subs page, the goal would not be to disappear them if we changed things. If we made the change, the goal would simply be to make /new more usable so we then get a better front page, instead of scaring everyone away from /new lol. But I can see the merit to leaving it as-is too, I honestly don't mind either way. Totally up to you.

[–]x0x7 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Is it an ethics thing? Because if so I can see where you are coming from, and agree with you. But didn't they ask to be off of /all. It seems like they want to be disappeared. If not, I would never be for censoring them.

Since the /all/new block and /all block are different, you could give the option to them. Then you don't have to feel bad about what happens.

To be more agnostic to ice_poseiden. It sucks that content floods /new that will never contribute to /all.

[–]magnora7 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It sucks that content floods /new

That's the whole reason I'm talking about it, and I even said that in my previous comment.

[–]happysmash27 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

/u/d3rr, this is the problem.

I made [a post about this[(https://saidit.net/comments/25dv) a while ago then got confused on how to respond since you had a different experience from me. ice_posiedon2 is blocked from the front page in hot, but still shows up in new despite me blocking it.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

IP2 should still show for everybody at /s/all/new and /s/all/comments unless you mute it. Does your IP2 mute show here https://saidit.net/subs/mine/muted ?

Edit: I think there's a disconnect here between 'block sub' and 'mute sub'. I think block is a RedReader app feature only, and does not affect the web site or even get stored here. Likewise, 'mute sub' does not appear in the app whatsoever.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    In the same way muting a sub on the main page didn't affect the app.

    Muting is supposed to affect the app. I think it does, my /s/all/new in the app is free from IP2.

    Well we're not making any changes yet, and the change would be to help everyone outside of these big subs.

    [–]FormosaOolong 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    You don't see the "mute sub" option?

    [–]Girlwiththeraventat 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

    I've been trying to browse new and respond to good discussion posts but another user was right that it's most filled with ice_posiedan shit. But I'll keep slogging through to hopefully boost good content.

    [–]FormosaOolong 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    You can mute IP2 and whatever else doesn't interest you for a more streamlined experience.

    [–]venecia 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

    I'm almost scared to ask - what is the ice poseidon thing all about?

    [–]Girlwiththeraventat 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    I honestly have no idea. I've never gone to that sub just seen it on /new. It's very active though.

    [–]magnora7 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

    Yeah we could probably speed the hot algorithm up by 20% or so now that we have more traffic. I'll look in to it

    [–]r721 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

    You should change "45000" constant in hot algorithm:

    https://medium.com/hacking-and-gonzo/how-reddit-ranking-algorithms-work-ef111e33d0d9

    45 000 seconds = 750 minutes = 12.5 hours

    This constant basically means that 12.5 hours old 100 points post is ranked the same as recent 10 points post using hot sorting (and 25 hours old 1000 points post and so on).

    [–]magnora7 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

    Alright I just reduced the hot seconds by 20%, so the front page should change more often now. We actually had it on 36 hours, now it's down to 30 hours. Now that we have enough comments and stuff it can support the faster change. We'll continue adjusting that down as we get more traffic. Thanks

    [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

    Could probably be reduced way lower since hot should probably be for more temporary stuff while using top with 24 hour setting shows the biggest posts of the day. At least that's how i like to use Reddit.

    [–]magnora7 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    Well if it gets reduced too much there are a lot of downsides so I'd rather change it gradually

    [–]theFriendlyDoomer 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

    I just don't think there is enough content yet for that to be possible. You can test that by clicking "new" instead of the default "hot," doing so you can get a feel for what is posted (at least that which is allowed to flow into "all" -- there are other subs that exist, here mostly for people a little more on the extreme side, politically).

    Many of the active subs only have a few posts a day.

    [–]x0x7 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    There is. I made several posts that didn't go anywhere. The problem is that new content can't compete with content that got upvoted during the migration, and so never makes it off the new page, and therefore doesn't get seen, and therefore doubly can't compete.

    This happens every post migration on every link aggregator site.

    Upvote /new

    [–]theFriendlyDoomer 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    That makes sense. You have the experience to see how these things have played out over time, so I believe you.

    [–]bobbobbybob 3 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 5 fun4 insightful - 6 fun -  (14 children)

    yeah, let's join a site, then change the way it works without learning about the different sort options available because that would be so cool amirite?

    cool hobby, full of people who are into its rules and invite new people in to share the fun.

    New people are not so much into the hobby, more like to be social, invite in even more people. Original rules change because they are not really what the new people want.

    Site fucked.

    How about keep the reddit cancer back in reddit?

    2 days, you've been here for 2 fucking days, you entitled prick

    [–]theFriendlyDoomer 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

    I read an article on the nature of sub-cultures that I think applies and amplifies what you're saying -- but, you know, without coming off as a bitter asshole.

    [–][deleted]  (1 child)

    [deleted]

      [–]theFriendlyDoomer 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Well, no judgement there. It just doesn't seem like it's the most fun way to live. Coupled with the fact that it doesn't accomplish anything, I try to avoid it when I can.

      [–]bobbobbybob 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

      tone policing? Member for 5 days and you come in and start tone policing.

      fuck, redditors are a bunch of entitled pricks, for real

      [–]theFriendlyDoomer 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

      Or, just read the article.

      [–]bobbobbybob 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

      or stop being a tone policing entitled prick.

      i mean, really. you post an article that says at length what I said very succinctly, and then be a dick about it? fuck off.

      [–]theFriendlyDoomer 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

      I don't think you get it. "Policing" would mean either of us have the ability to shut down the other.

      You get to say something. I get to say something. You don't have to like what I say. I don't have to like what you say. Throwing a fucking temper tantrum won't do any good with me. So you fuck off.

      [–]bobbobbybob 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      after you, fuckhead

      [–]theFriendlyDoomer 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      :)

      [–]NorfolkTerrier[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      This was a post asking others what they thought, it's certainly fine that you disagree, and I don't want the site to thoughtlessly copy Reddit in every regard.

      In SaidIt's case, there doesn't appear to be a "rising" sort option, so it's either "new" posts with little/no engagement yet, or "hot" posts that are a little on the older side, where much of the engagement is already past. I thought it might be nice to show users more discussions that are newer but are already active, giving them a jumping point to get more involved. If someone is an occasional user, they'll want to see the best posts from the last couple days, but if someone is trying to visit regularly, help grow the site, and consistently contribute to conversations, then they may prefer a front page that's updating a little more often.

      I trust the people running SaidIt enough to assume that they won't just instantly change how the site works without thinking about it because a new person posted about it. I wouldn't support a huge change, just a little nudge towards newer content, and it's up to the admins to discuss anything like that.

      [–]bobbobbybob 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      you don't get it do you. even now, you still think your input has any value yet, you want changes straight away, you want the world to adjust to you.

      You are entitled.

      [–]cloudrabbit 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      Nice gatekeeping

      [–]bobbobbybob 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Thanks. gatekeepers are a wonderful ting, and maintain the integrity of spaces wonderfully.

      [–]Jesus 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      That be awesome!

      [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Aye. Tis a fine idea.

      [–]Jesus 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Or even like a newer section at the top and top post at the bottom.

      [–]magnora7 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

      Done! I just sped it up by 20%

      [–]wrongthink 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

      by 20%

      The activision-blizzard approach to balance.

      [–]magnora7 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Ha is that what they do too? It just seemed like the smallest definintely-noticeable amount

      [–]anarchy753 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

      Also is there any way to block people? I'd love to be able to sort by new without it just being pages and pages of that one person spamming /s/entertainment with what is clearly links to their own site.

      On reddit you got the option to block someone after reporting them, but it seems like here you would need them to personally reply to you, and they don't.

      [–]magnora7 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

      You can block them from PMs if they PM you but developing a more fully-fledged block feature is near the top of our to do list.

      [–]anarchy753 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Cool, that's the main issue, I'm pretty sure they're just a bot account that automatically posts any update to their site. Tried replying to one and just had no response from them.

      [–]wrongthink 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      On reddit it's even possible to block people without reporting them, but you have to access the API through a client/browser side script as described here: https://old.reddit.com/r/redditdev/comments/3nvrdi/deleting_post_replies_from_inbox_i_need_help_and/cvrttje/

      [–]Shitskinned_Faggot 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

      Another such Reddit clone site has had a lot of complaints from Rexxit refugees that the only thing on their front page was alt right political content, so the Devs already stated intentions of caving in by considering stopping any political posts appearing on the front page because they also want it to be full of cats, battlestations and transformers and whatnot (so some form of soft quarantine on political posts?).

      But what exactly are they gonna do if no one there is going to post cats, battlestations and their chemically mutilated faces? Said it does this right in one of its disclaimers saying if you don't see any content you like then make it yourself? Go ahead and make your own LGBTBBQBLTXXYXPEDOBEASTIALITYINCEST sub whatever and post whatever you think the front page needs. Then go and sepakku yourself when no one upvotes or pays any attention to it.

      [–]kokolokoNightcrawler 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      Yep, was gonna make a similar post. You could put it in s/askSaidit as well

      [–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

      The New tab is right beside the Hot tab.

      [–][deleted]  (1 child)

      [deleted]

        [–]NorfolkTerrier[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

        Thanks for the tip!

        [–]Inspector_Monkfish 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

        Also add an option to condense the posts so one can see more at a glance.

        [–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

        The new tab already shows the new posts! I lurk there from time to time. Be the change you want to see, right?