RantB in LG spaces dilemma

submitted by lazy-summer-godSuper Gay from self.LGBDropTheT

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[–]RaspberryTea 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (22 children)

I wonder how many of these "bi" people are basically just straight, but desperate to be part of the +~QUEER~+ club. I'll bet it's rather common these days, given there's now clout to be gained if you're desperate enough and/or have enough cluster B traits going on.

As for the rest, it seems logical to me that bisexual people with significant, serious same-sex attraction would want to be around gays/lesbians to talk about those experiences and feelings. It's the common ground we share. And there really isn't a viable bisexual community, probably because we're so varied. You've got men, you've got women, you've got those who are mostly same-sex attracted, those who are mostly hetero, the ones who fall right in the middle, the ones who vary with the wind.... It's kind of hard to organize that and on top of this, the newly out ones assume they'll be welcome in the the LGB community. Which, again, seems logical, but it doesn't always work out that way--as the OP here demonstrates. This can lead to some weird effects, such as the significantly same-sex attracted ones calling themselves gay or lesbian so they'll have a place to call home. Hell, when I first came out, I definitely felt pressured to call myself a lesbian and even did for a while because of all the talk about how horrible bi women are.

Unfortunately, the loudest ones also tend to be the straightest. Like the women who are married to men and can't STFU about how ~KWEER~ their marriage is and how they're SO GAY. It's obnoxious and fucks things up for everyone IMO.

EDIT: In case anyone assumes I'm blaming this entire mess on "fake bisexuals", that's not the case. I do think some of it comes from there, but not all of it. Some of it (as I alluded to) probably is coming from bi people who identify as gay for whatever reason, and (since the OP was specifically about the gay male side of things) I'd bet my mother's life at least some of it is coming from FTMs calling themselves gay men.

[–]schomee 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (21 children)

That phenomenon is only true for women. No straight man would ever identify as bi. This whole "appropriating lesbianism" thing is exclusive to bisexual women since lesbians barely experience actual, real homophobia and their sexuality is a fun fetish and costume to put on.

It absolutely is not a fun fetish to put on for straight men. The barrier for bisexual men is so high that anyone who says it is absolutely bi, 100%. It's just that they want their "straight side represented" and end up wanting to push their "straight side" in gay spaces, which leads to problems since gay spaces are very small and bisexuals have the rest of earth for their "straight side". Most of their persecution complex is wanting to go into non homophobic spaces but bring their heterosexuality with them and that usually involves some homophobic spouse or stranger or "friend" where gays just want to be free to be comfortable not being around heterosexuals. It's similar to an all woman space but women constantly bringing men in there.

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Lesbians barely experience actual, real homophobia

Gee, if I didn't know you better, I'd say you have a hatred of lack of understanding of bisexuals and lesbians

[–]schomee 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

Gee, almost like your narcissism completely ruins the gay and lesbian community when you try to put yourself front and center and whine that you're the biggest victim of a certain problem..and that systemically spreads out. hmmmm.

All true patriarchies murder what they consider its traitors. In iran, gays are executed. Lesbians are not. Theyre just considered a theory for amusement. Do you want to put yourself front and center there?

In saudi arabia, gays are executed. Lesbians are not. Do you want to make it all about yourself there?

In all african countries, gays are executed, or tortured and imprisoned. Lesbians are just considered a funny theory or a sex fetish. Do you want to put yourself front and center there as well? It's almost like most of these homosexual disasters when it comes to creating a solution are highly corrupted, ineffective and useless since theyre secretly meant to advance your interests over actual homophobic issues.

You come last. Because you matter less when it comes to homophobia. Thanks for contributing to the gay civil rights movement by the...oh thats right. You didnt lol.

[–]PenseePansyBio-Sex or Bust 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

If lesbians seem less targeted, it's because their oppression as WOMEN is so complete already. Is she being treated as disposable-- beaten, raped, murdered-- because she's a lesbian... or just because she's a woman? Often, it's hard to tell.

That really doesn't sound like a very enviable position.

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Don't waste your time with him. He's a troll and keeps making alts.

[–]TransspeciesUnicornI sexually identify as a mythical sparkly equine 6 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

Is this the same guy who keeps getting banned that basically hates everyone except white gay men?

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yep

[–]schomee 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

She's privileged as a woman to exist in a patriarchy compared to gay men. Let's not pretend this forum isn't infested with "radical feminists", who have a joke for a political ideology that has the privilege of coming up with highly distorted and false views of the world because they can afford to be wrong and ridiculous since they dont need an accurate view of the world. There could be an asteroid heading towards earth right now to annihilate all life and a radical feminist would claim "the asteroid is sexist because it's going to kill all women".

And no, lesbians are not more oppressed because theyre women. But there you go again, trying to put yourself front and center since your only connection to the homosexual community is elbowing your way in between gays and lesbians with "radical feminism". Plenty of women are highly privileged in the patriarchy. Most of them are compared to gay men. Just because gay men do better than you, INSPITE of their more extreme conditions, doesnt mean the system doesnt benefit you more. Pretty sure a flat out genocide against gays is a tad bit worse than mere fetishization or amusement.

If you want to play "who's more oppressed", heterosexual and bisexual women oppress homosexuals..both male and female. We built a community that allows us to excel passed you most of the time and that makes you seethe because you assumed your heterosexual privilege would help you with that.

So tell me about the oppression of women in iran and how it compares to gay people...in iran. It's like comparing a mosquito bite to having a missile shot at you.

What youre attempting to do here is no less embarrassing than when feminists tried invading the holocaust center academically to claim that jewish women had it worse because they got raped, which is false since the jewish men couldn't be used for sex so they just shot them.

So your point makes absolutely no sense because it's desperately trying to imply that gay males somehow benefit from the patriarchy, which makes it it's mission to commit genocide against them. You're more privileged as a woman in a patriarchy and this clearly shows. But go ahead and center yourself and show us all how useless your ideology is. It's done a super great and convincing job explaining "transbians", correct? The heterosexual men in wigs are pure evil rapists/incels who do this because theyre sick, BUT the rapists/homophobic straight/bi women are completely innocent and brainwashed and that's why they all identify as gay men and demand to rape confused teenage boys.

I have an ovarit account and have read almost every single post and comment. Your narcissism constantly gets in the way of properly diagnosing things because you demand to center yourself in everything.

[–]usehername 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

In iran, gays are executed. Lesbians are not.

Untrue: https://www.refworld.org/docid/3ae6ad8bc.html

In saudi arabia, gays are executed. Lesbians are not.

Also untrue: https://lifeinsaudiarabia.net/punishment-of-adultery-zina-and/

The only exception is pregnant women and women with children under two years old. Once the child is two, the woman will be executed.

You come last. Because you matter less when it comes to homophobia.

Source?

Thanks for contributing to the gay civil rights movement by the...oh thats right. You didnt lol.

Women did not have full rights at that time and still don't (though not to as great of an extent), but they did contribute.

[–]RaspberryTea 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

No straight man would ever identify as bi.

Just because a thing is rare doesn't mean it never happens. I've had a couple of definitely-straight guys tell me they were bisexual basically because they found anime boys attractive. Sure, they might have said it to impress(?) me in particular, but it's proof that it CAN happen. And considering how everyone wants in the club these days....

But I agree it probably isn't the current route of choice since Trans grabs more attention. And depending on how you go about it, it doesn't even take any effort. From what I've seen, straight guys who really want to be ~QUEER~ mostly seem to call themselves nonbinary or decide they're women and start calling themselves lesbians. Which is partly why this forum exists.

lesbians barely experience actual, real homophobia

Is that really a can of worms you want to open up? I won't dwell on this, but I will say that just because lesbians experience a different form of homophobia doesn't mean it isn't "real" or that it doesn't have consequences. Sometimes horrific ones, including corrective rape.

As for the rest, well.... You do you.

[–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

FYI, this guy is a troll who keeps making alts, would not take anything he says seriously lol. u/exponent2

[–]schomee 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

I dont think you understand how intense homophobia is and how it works in the gay world, where it's meant to be used for and homophobia towards lesbians is more like ricocheting bullets. No bisexual is trying to identify as gay. It's almost like saying a bunch of non pedophiles are trying to appropriate the stigma of pedophilia. It's an extreme example but you understand that the stigma is the barrier. If someone says theyre a pedophile, you believe them. Just like we dont doubt when someone admits they're a rapist. The stigma is the certification. The homophobia is extreme on the male end. They might tell you because you're bi but you're in a cosmopolitan city. Plenty of "straight" men tell me theyre bi all the time but theyre not lining up to claim the word gay from gay people. That's only women who do that because it's "fun" on their end as a costume to put on that they can take off.

What's that saying straight men have? "you can fuck 10,000 women but if you kiss one guy when you were 15, then you'll be gay forever". Lesbians and women dont have a true understanding of homophobia because it's not really meant for them. You have lesbians and bisexual women at war with one another over gatekeeping the word lesbian. The word "gay" is walled off and protected by a giant powerful barrier of stigma that keeps it "clean".

[–]RaspberryTea 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

...Since I feel like I just wandered into the "Woman yelling at cat" meme, imma bow out now

[–]schomee 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

you're attempting to blame everything on "fake bi's". I explained to you that unlike in the lesbian world, in the gay world, there arent bi men clamoring to appropriate the word bi or gay. There's too much of a stigma. That was to counter your "all these fake bi people" deflection. I went into very thorough detail to explain this to you. You understood it very well. Almost all bi men are deeply closeted.

[–]usehername 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

No bisexual is trying to identify as gay.

This is absolutely untrue, though they may be rare. These bis make being "gay" a huge part of their identity, usually have some trauma with the opposite sex, and are heavily same-sex leaning. Have you changed your stance? I remember agreeing on this earlier.

Plenty of "straight" men tell me theyre bi all the time

Really? When/where? What demographic? I've just never met one, which ik is anecdotal. edit: Wait, are they actually straight or not? Unclear.

The word "gay" is walled off and protected by a giant powerful barrier of stigma that keeps it "clean".

Ik we're talking about bis here, but plenty of women are appropriating the word (though for fetishistic reasons), so it's not much of a stretch to say that bi men may do the same.

As for straights appropriating bi, that seems to be a lot less common than people think, and is used as a scapegoat every single time, as if no bisexual has ever done anything that could harm the rest of LGB (since they are also hurting themselves).

[–]schomee 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

My main point was that i highly doubt a bunch of straight men are identifying as bi or gay for fun. In their world, there's massive stigma attached to it. Even bi men have trouble coming out as bi so it's not like it's some fun costume for a straight man to try on for fun. If there are cases, it's usually from extremely cosmopolitan areas.

[–]usehername 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

My main point was that i highly doubt a bunch of straight men are identifying as bi or gay for fun.

I agree with that, but there are bi men who identify as gay for many reasons.

[–]PassionateIntensity 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah, who's that actor-- uh...Ezra Miller. Straight douchebag calls himself queer because he's attracted to women who call themselves non-binary. It's rare but it happens in super lefty spaces sometimes.

[–]usehername 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Schomee, lesbians are executed along with gay men in many countries.

This whole "appropriating lesbianism" thing is exclusive to bisexual women since lesbians barely experience actual, real homophobia and their sexuality is a fun fetish and costume to put on.

These yaoi gals are also using "gay" as a "fun fetish and costume to put on", doesn't mean they don't experience actual, real homophobia, though it is different because they're different sexes.

[–]Destresse🇨🇵 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

The difference is, while gay men are usually punished in public, lesbians are punished in private.

[–]lovelyspearmintLesbeing a lesbian 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Well said.

[–]reluctant_commenter 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Hot damn. I've never heard anyone put it that way before but that's so true.