all 29 comments

[–]endthewoo[S] 34 insightful - 1 fun34 insightful - 0 fun35 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

One of the signatories on twitter:

"I can't emphasize enough the range of viewpoints attached to this letter, but neither can i over-emphasize the climate of fear that led many people you know and admire to tell us in confidence that they agreed but were afraid to sign. This is why such a statement is necessary."

[–]MarkTwainiac 24 insightful - 3 fun24 insightful - 2 fun25 insightful - 3 fun -  (5 children)

I saw some tweets saying no one who signed the letter has ever been subject to censorship or silencing themselves in recent or living memory. Which ignores that Publisher's Weekly has reported that many independent and "feminist" bookstores in the US are now refusing to carry JKRowling's books, and that another one of the signatories is Salman Rushdie.

[–]womenopausal 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

another one of the signatories is Salman Rushdie.

jesus. learn some fucken history kids. i recc this book - https://www.amazon.com/From-Fatwa-to-Jihad-Kenan-Malik-audiobook/dp/B003LZK4ZC

[–]DogeWalker 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Why not a history book?

[–]womenopausal 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Kenan Malik had the best take on the Rushdie Affair. It won multiple awards iirc. It's a very good read.

[–]fedup31 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

...I’m sorry, even aside from Salman Rushdie, are none of these people old enough to remember that Harry Potter was one of the most banned books of the 90s and 2000s? All the Christian groups trying to ban it for “promoting witchcraft”?

[–]kuronekochan 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Also ignores the fact that only powerful people can sign this letter, and many artists, writers, and academics who are less well-situated would be afraid to. Those who are proactively suppressing their point of view for fear of reprisal are invisible. Self-censorship is still censorship, when it is coerced.

[–]NDG 16 insightful - 1 fun16 insightful - 0 fun17 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

I wonder if Jennifer Finney Boylan signing will have any positive impact on TRAs. My guess is they’ll just chalk it up to JFB’s white privilege or something.

[–]endthewoo[S] 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

There's a real mix in there - including Magaret Atwood

[–]vijfkeervier 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Deirdre McCloskey is another trans person who signed it.

[–]purrfect 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

JFB has decided to identify out of the vertebrate group:

"I did not know who else had signed that letter. I thought I was endorsing a well meaning, if vague, message against internet shaming. I did know Chomsky, Steinem, and Atwood were in, and I thought, good company.

The consequences are mine to bear. I am so sorry."

[–]endthewoo[S] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

He signs a letter for open debate - but only on the basis that the others that sign it are people that he likes ??

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Boylan has already disavowed the letter and implied he was tricked into signing it.

[–]materialrealityplz 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Man, these people have so little backbone...

[–][deleted] 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Interesting that Margaret Atwood signed after that nonsense she tweeted this morning (yesterday? What even is time anymore?).

[–]endthewoo[S] 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

She'll have signed before today, so maybe the nonsense is an after-the-fact panic to stop a pile-on. She is already in the bad books of many for criticising metoo and being too white, will be interesting to see if pandering to the trans works as absolution (as it would if she were a man, cf Damien Barr Booker debacle)

[–]sallyseton 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Yes, now I suspect yesterday's tweet was made in anticipation of this letter, trying to offset the trans mob.

[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Explains why she interacted in a respectful way with Jane Clare Jones too.

[–]PassionateIntensity 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

She'll have signed before today, so maybe the nonsense is an after-the-fact panic to stop a pile-on.

Good point.

[–]chickensizzle 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Is she pro TRA? How on earth do you write as much as she did about women being held down as a second class over childbirth....and think that can apply to men?

[–]denverkris 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

what nonsense? I've been booted off twitter so many times i kind of gave up

[–]Nona_Biba 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

i havent read the article she linked but it's obvious it's ~sex isn't binary~ bullshit

[–]denverkris 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

@drclairejones had the perfect response. "how did the people in gilead know which people to make into handmaidens?"

edit: i had to get off of twitter, i couldn't devote more energy to arguing with these nutbags

[–]denverkris 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think that's one of the most ludicrous arguments that they try to make. It's like come on bro, how hard did you have to try to convince yourself of this bs

[–][deleted] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Dang, that is a HUGE range of names! Much respect to them, ALL of them, regardless of how much I may disagree with some of them.

[–]Hard_headed_woman 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Unfortunately, there seems to be a number of folks who think this is pushback against Black Lives Matter.

[–]fuckingsealions 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Black lives DO matter, but half the world's population is invisible. 🙄

[–]PassionateIntensity 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

At least Atwood signed. I don't mean to harp, she's just a real disappointment at the moment.

[–]jkfinn 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's a good thing "trans" wasn't cited as a example, because then the list would have shrunk to two. (anyway what they're referring to is what social media, and real TV have wrought... well, a huge role, i'd say)