QT: If anorexics identify as underweight, is it wrong to give them weight-restoring treatment?

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[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (20 children)

I'm not condemning neurotypical people. I'm saying there is nothing wrong with being neuro diverse. Temple Grandin said "the world needs all kinds of minds".

You are entitled to your opinion. I do realize I can't advocate for everyone. For instance at the Republican National Convention, a few black men said Trump isn't racist. However, most black and indigenous people including my own friends say he's racist, so I go with the majority opinion. Same with autism. Many autistic people dislike Autism Speaks. I know of 2 autistic people that are involved in the organization, Carly Fleischmann and Kerry Magro, but most autistic people don't like the organization.

Why Autism Speaks Doesn't Speak For Me

Why I am Against Autism Speaks (and you should be, too)

Responding to Autism Speaks

"I, Too": My Autism Speaks Story

A Roundup of Posts Against Autism Speaks

So as a result when I was in college I called them out for having Autism Speaks U, I refused to participate in fundraisers for Autism Speaks, and when a person asked me if I'm involved in Autism Speaks U, I politely explained most autistic people don't like that organization. I understand there will always be exceptions.

I once met an autistic activist who says she uses her autism to advocate for her low functioning brother. I told her many autistic people don't like functioning labels and she said she disagrees and uses functioning labels. She also wore a puzzle piece kippah and is aware of the puzzle piece controversy. I talked to her about ASAN and she said she was kicked out of ASAN because she didn't oppose residential treatment centers (she was in an RTC herself and said it helped her). While in general I like ASAN, they shouldn't have kicked her out for having the wrong opinion. She told me I should get involved in disability activism.

So at the end of the day I do realize I won't be able to please everyone with my advocacy and that's OK. It's rare to have a 100% consensus on anything. So I go with what the majority from a group say. I read books like The Reason I jump, and Carly's voice, I read blogs by autistic people, watch videos and documentaries that feature autistic voices. Not all the blogs I read are written by "high functioning" people. Most of the people in the blogs can't speak and require support, but use AAC.

And because I have a disability myself, I have personal experience with ableism and am fighting against it like everybody else. But I understand our disabilities vary and thus our experiences with ableism vary. While I was unlawfully segregated in a special ed class. I was always spoken to like other kids my age. Many autistic people who are non-verbal reported being spoken to like infants before they had the chance to communicate with AAC. Even "high functioning" autistic people reported being treated as incompetent. Heck, many visibly disabled adults still get spoken to like little kids, or others speak to the able-bodied person with them, and not the disabled person. That's why I always repeat "presume competence" and this is one of the few things there is a 100% consensus on in our community.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

Are you deliberately missing my points or what?

I said recognising a disorder is not condemnation of neuroatypical people. Not that you’re condemning anyone.

Please actually read what I’m saying.

Your experiences and posts on ASD forums is still not actually a representative of the majority of people with ASDs regardless of what books you read. Do you truly believe that the majority of autistic people read those books or post on those forums? That’s legitimately ignorant of how we actually live. This is offensive. You are incorrectly mispreresentimg the experiences and needs of a group of people that you are not a part of. I’m aware of people being treated poorly due to ASDs but this does not make it not a disorder.

Are you seriously still going to sit there and inform me about my own fucking disorder? Do you not comprehend how selfish and rude that is?
How fuckin dare you. You’re not our advocate just because you put yourself on the back and listen to a couple of people you agree with. Advocates don’t speak for people or over them and this is all you’re doing here. Go pick some other cause and leave us alone, it would be more helpful that telling actual autistic people that they are wrong about their own fuckin autism.

Autism speaks is entirely irrelevant why do you bring up random nonsense instead of addressing actual points given? Are you incapable of understanding what I’m saying?

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (18 children)

I personally feel insulted when people say stuff like "lead poisoning causes learning disabilities". Don't get me wrong, lead poisioning should be prevented, but no one says things like "lead poisoning causes red hair". This is because people think there is nothing wrong with red hair. The same way nothing is wrong with learning disabilities. It's just another human characteristic.

Your experiences and posts on ASD forums is still not actually a representative of the majority of people with ASDs regardless of what books you read. Do you truly believe that the majority of autistic people read those books or post on those forums?

Where can I find opinions that are representative of the majority of autistic people?

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

You can’t. So you need to stop speaking for people with ASDs.

Lead did cause learning disabilities. It’s extremely toxic and damages the brain. Idk why you hate facts so much and perpetuate nonsense. It’s like getting offended over someone saying thalidomide causes malformations or ameliorated limbs.

[–]ColoredTwiceIntersex female, medical malpractice victim, lesbian 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Men were whole my life "mansplaining" me what being lesbian is and how to be correct lesbian. At one point it stopped (around 10-15 years ago), but now it started again.

Now it is "healthysplaining" to people with disorders about their disorders?

Seems gender ideologists are ableists too, not just homophobic and misogynistic.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

“Allow me to explain to you that the symptoms of your disorder that impede your day to day functioning are not actually a disability, just another fun way to be! Auditory processing disorder isn’t an impairment! It’s just another way to hear things :)”

Yeah sure and paralysed is just another lovely functional way for legs to be.

Mansplaining is exactly what it feels like, you hit the nail on the head there. That perfect combo of not listening and condescending insistence.

Niceness as a mask for “my opinions are authority”.

[–]ColoredTwiceIntersex female, medical malpractice victim, lesbian 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

About two decades ago, we had a joke here "being dead is just being alternatively alive". Seems it isn't a joke anymore.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Illiteracy is just another way to read. Dyscalculia is another way to do maths. Executive dysfunction is just a different way of functioning.

You could make a million of these lmao.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

It's not the facts, it's the implication that there is something wrong with learning disabilities. Have you ever heard people use the phrase "risk of red hair" or "risk of blue eyes" as if there's something wrong with those characteristics. On NYC's [child & adolescent health examination form](www.schools.nyc.gov/docs/default-source/default-document-library/ch205-child-adolescent-health-examination-form-english), they use the phrase developmental or learning problem as if there is something wrong with learning differences. There are tons of reasons to prevent lead poisoning. Learning differences is NOT one of them.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Red hair does not potentially limit someone or cause them hardship. A severe learning disorder or cognitive disability does. That’s obvious.

This is also entirely irrelevant to me correcting your idea that autism is not a disorder.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

My learning disability never caused me hardship. Society caused me a lot more hardship.

Yes, I have limitations. I struggled with math a lot in school. But we all have limitations.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Your experience is not universal and you do not get to negate the experience of anyone who does feel their disability has impaired them or caused them hardship.

It gets far harder than struggling with maths for many people and you are essentially erasing their experiences because they don’t match your own.

If you really want to advocate for people you need far more empathy and listening ability. So far you have spoken for and over people whilst ignoring the people you are claiming to support.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (3 children)

Do you have a learning disability? No. You do not get to speak for people with learning disabilities or explain my disability to me.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Yes. Auditory processing disorder and dyscaculia. Why do you get to speak over me about autism but I can’t discuss the experiences you share with others? Why do you presume my experiences? Why does your offence matter and mine doesn’t?

What authority do you supposedly have? What point do you actually have? You ignore every question asked if you and bring up random trails unrelated to the original post.

[–]strictly 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I personally feel insulted when people say stuff like "lead poisoning causes learning disabilities". Don't get me wrong, lead poisoning should be prevented, but no one says things like "lead poisoning causes red hair". This is because people think there is nothing wrong with red hair. The same way nothing is wrong with learning disabilities. It's just another human characteristic.

You say your ADHD is definitely a disorder. There are also people who have ADHD who don't consider it a disorder and don't want a cure. If they felt insulted by the medication for making ADHD sound like something that should be controlled, would you agree with them?

Reading your other posts it seems you dislike people talking about risk regarding developing disabilities. But you would agree that minimizing the risk of working accidents chopping off people's arms would be good thing, no? And it wouldn't mean you look down one-armed people. There are people who lose a limb and become stronger humans for it, some even say they wouldn't go back and change it as they learned from it. But that doesn't mean we shouldn't still try to prevent these working accidents when we can. I don't see the difference from that and wanting to prevent people developing learning disabilities (unless you are talking about personality traits that are incorrectly labeled as learning disabilities).

I have autism and I wouldn't want a new personality but many people fit the broad autistic phenotype without having autism the developmental disorder, so I imagine if I hadn't been autistic I would still have been me but my brain would work more like I would want it to work like.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

If someone doesn't want a cure for ADHD, that's fine. But I've never heard anyone wanting to cure their learning disabilities.

[–]strictly 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I've never heard anyone wanting to cure their learning disabilities.

Well I've heard people with learning disabilities who do, not size fits all.

I think many people who struggle in school would struggle less if society had been more accommodating. I personally have a problem with my short term memory. Many situations where poor short term memory is noticeable would have been a lot easier if people were more patient, as poor short term memory can be compensated for with the long term memory and note-taking, making it barely noticeable later. But even if we say society had been more accommodating for people with poor short term memory, making it much less of a problem overall, it's still a limitation. And sure , we all have certain limitations we struggle with, but personally I don't really enjoy having a limitation for the heck of it.

You say you don't think learning disabilities should be prevented or cured. What if someone with ADHD who views ADHD as a positive thing wanted the medication to banned, would you similarly agree that it should be banned?

If someone doesn't want a cure for ADHD, that's fine.

And if someone does want a cure for their learning disability that should be fine too, right?

Let's say a certain batch of gene-modified carrots caused anyone eating one to struggle in maths, should parents aware of this think dyscalculia isn't something that should be prevented and feed their unaware children with it anyway? What if the child has dreams about studying maths in college and wants a cure, and there exists a cure, should the child be denied it?

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

You say you don't think learning disabilities should be prevented or cured. What if someone with ADHD who views ADHD as a positive thing wanted the medication to banned, would you similarly agree that it should be banned?

If that's how the majority felt than yeah.

[–]strictly 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If that's how the majority felt than yeah.

Shouldn't what the minority wants count for something too? There are people who sees dying from cancer as natural part of life, and don't want treatment, if they were the majority, should they really have the right to deny other people getting the treatment, even those who want to survive? Similarly with people who have ADHD, shouldn't those who want the medication get it even if the majority wouldn't want it? It seems fair that someone can refuse treatment for themselves, their body, their choice, but it doesn't seem fair that they should be given the right to deny other people getting their treatment.