Is Pride Still Necessary? Conservative vs Liberal Gays | Middle Ground | Jubilee

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-12T03:26:34+00:00

He literally conflated FtMs with MtFs lol

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-12T04:30:21+00:00

This entire thing was so dull and surface level it hurts.

The first section was almost entirely dedicated to the topic of respectability politics, or the old duality of "gays can't do x, because straights will think bad of them" and "gays can do x, because straights do it too", not to the way the oversexualization cited affects the gay community and the lives of actual gay men. No! It's all about the straights!

The second section was an anecdote fest: "I don't suffer any kind of discrimination in my life, so pride isn't necessary anymore" against "there are people who do, so pride is still necessary". Also, another point of discussion was the presence of sexuality at pride, which was again, nothing beyond circular back-and-foward.

The "I would date a transmen" part was even worse: the ones who claimed they would do it did everything they could to not touch on the subject of actual sex and intimacy with a trans partner: "well you'll see, sex and intimacy isn't only about interacting with the actual body of your partner, and I don't want to close myself to the possibility of finding that one unicorn FtM^tm who I might fall for".

The funniest part was the "sex isn't about sucking things or penetrating things, I'm totally not being evasive here making shit up in order to avoid touching in the vagina question".

Yeah, sex and intimacy is about rubbing their very male brains together until they climax! That's how it works!

Do they even realize this same argument could be done about women? Hell, homophobic asshats vomit shit like this all the time!

This was the argument of 2 out of the 3 who stayed in the circle, the last one simply vomited "trans experience this", "trans experience that" and avoided the actual question being discussed like a plague.

You know what this sounds to me? "I have zero interest in dating a FtM, but I have to pretend to in order to belong on my social circle and avoid acusations of transphobia".

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T05:13:19+00:00

I’ll get invited to a bathhouse or an underwear party and have to say no because chest scars would out me and I wouldn’t be wanted there.

Is this... self-awareness? I can't believe it!

I’ll get invited to a club/dance event and might go but see that the whole thing is incredibly penis-focused and realize again that no one would want me there if they knew I was trans.

So far, so good!

I have a crazy body

Press X to doubt.

I’ve tested it out by making a profile that’s exactly the same as my usual profile only not stating I’m FTM, body pics and all, and the difference in interest is ridiculous.

I'll have to press X on this one again.

Why? She herself admitted to having pretty visible mastectomy scars.

This alone already makes her very easy to clock.

The only guys I can hook up with are gay guys with a one-time gross chaser fantasy or bisexual men that I suspect are cheating on their wives. I basically have to give up on any morals and standards to get laid.

I got some news for you: these fetishists are not gay in the same way GAMPs aren't straight.

These are fetishists who fixate on the idea of a "male vagina" in the same way GAMPs fixate on the idea of a "female penis". They only see you as an object, nothing more.

I don’t disclose being trans on dating app profiles since I occasionally encounter people I know on there, so I wait until after the first date, and I have a 100% rejection rate after disclosing.

We got a contradiction here: this person claimed to not "go stealth" on dating apps previously. Either she lied or a good portion of this is bullshit.

I’m going to be in my mid 30s soon

The magical age HRT starts doing it's magic!

By "magic" I mean "completely fucking up people".

I hope this person's got a hypersectomy, otherwise things will get pretty ugly from now on. See Buck Angel for more details on this little chestnut.

I feel doomed to be lonely and alone in gay spaces for the rest of my life because I’m done transitioning so it’s not like I can say “oh things will get better further in transition, I just have to wait it out.” I’m exhausted.

Yeah, It's all downhill from here.

The FtMs who go for the "soft boo uwu" aesthetic start to look really bad from this age forward.

She does only have two options here: either bulk up and risk the Buck Angel effect even earlier than expected or go for the drug addict look, which is just sad.

Also, even though the level of delusion in the comments is pretty low, it's still pretty interesting to see how much an average FtMs is clueless about gay culture:

"Oh no, they think way too much about dick!"

"Oh no, they think too much about sex!"

"Oh no, they don't like to hang around annoying Aideens"

Did these people only learn about gay culture on Netflix series and Yaoi?

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-12-11T06:43:05+00:00

Most transactivists of old, and their queer enablers, were always against same-sex marriage.

They using this specific cause as an example of right "given to the gays" by the them is beyond nonsensical and hypocritical.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-12-11T06:40:38+00:00

Relevant:

As you can see, OP just deleted this post and then deleted their account.

This was not an organic post. This was trans propaganda cooked up in the trans sub.

Once OP saw that many of us were pushing back they decided to nuke the post.

The post was an ops made by the trans subs exclusively to stir up shit, like many others before it.

This is becoming so frequent that even the posters of the sub themselves are starting to catch up to it.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-10-12T19:46:45+00:00

If that's their objective, than they're failing spectacularly at it.

The first post has zero comments and upvotes. The OP or the moderation probably deleted it in recognition on how stupid it was.

The second has more of a "my head is frying from trying to figure out non-binary bs" more than anything.

A problem common on r/askgaybros recently is the amount of bait posts trying to stir up shit. I remember one that was basically asking bi men if they preferred anal or piv sex and to provide descriptions of the acts.

Let's say that most gay men on the sub weren't exacly amused by the post nor the responses to it. In fact, it could be said that it served more to "red pill" (I hate the term, but I believe it's appropriate on this context) the ones there.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-10-03T19:53:17+00:00

This person knows nothing about Chis if they believe this.

The whole context behind Chis's "transition" was that the trolls convinced him that it would be easier to get female (specifically lesbian) attention if he became a MtF.

He never displayed any same-sex attraction whatsoever, in fact, on the contrary: he was (and still is) homophobic.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-24T18:25:08+00:00

I really think something like social media or whole internet collapse is due to happen soon.

This is pure, concentrated copium.

What might happen is the continuation of what's already in course: the surface internet becoming more and more controlled and online life becoming more and more centralized into few giant social media sites.

At best, people might migrate in masse for the "deep web" and less centralized online networks, but even that is farfetched.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-24T07:16:29+00:00

People mostly blame the LGBT "community" as a whole,they do not target gay men/people specifically

Depends.

Many people still use gay men and lesbians as the base they use to evaluate the other letters in the soup.

Case in point: even today many still believe that the average MtF is the equivalent of an extremely effeminate gay men, and so they extend the sympathy they have for gay men to MtFs as a whole.

Of course,I have observed the occasional user screaching about sodomites,fire and brimstone.

Most of those are going to get laughted at IRL.

Even the religious fundamentalist/homophobic politician of today knows how to adjust their language and presentation to be better palatable to the masses, not because they care about not being bigoted, but as a matter of basic pragmatism.

Anyone with even a single braincell knows that this kind of overt shit doesn't fly anymore on the mainstream.

Many people from the so called political Right,even religious ones,saying they have no problem with gay people,because they understand that trans activism represents something new and separate from the gay rights movement,which had live and let live as it's core message.

See the point above.

Even though these groups claim to have nothing against gay and lesbian people, they would not hesitate for a second to roll back many of the advances in regards to gay rights won in the last few years if they had the power and opportunity to do so.

Let's not kid ourselves here.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-24T07:06:04+00:00

we're due for a cataclysmic event soon that will basically break society and then we'll have to rebuild.

I mean, the pandemic already happened, didn't it?

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-24T07:04:33+00:00

this man's "work" is most likely posting stupid shit on twitter and calling it activism

Ah, the good old slacktivism!

These wastes of space appropriating the hard work of others is nothing new.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-24T07:04:14+00:00

Queer women, trans people, and bisexuals/have pansexuals have fought like hell—done far more than cis gay men

[CITATION NEEDED]

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-21T06:09:35+00:00

What did she expect?

No-strings-attached sex and one night stands are frequent on Grindr and other dating apps. Hell, both things are prevalent on mainstream gay culture.

This is what happens when your brain is full on Netflix's YA shows and Yaoi manga.

The most likely context behind a gay men's first sex experience won't be a romantic candles-lighted encounter, unfortunately.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-21T06:03:41+00:00

I have an awful habit of going on grindr when I'm feeling bad about myself

We're off to a great start, aren't we?

Cue the most confusing, disappointing sex ever. He would not stop asking really weird questions like "So you were born that way? How does it work? Do other people know you have [afab parts]?".

This is a fetishist, plain and simple.

This person is a GAMP, in the same way the men who fetishize MtFs are: he views them as an object, nothing more.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-20T02:21:53+00:00

I have heard young lesbians use those terms frequently these days.

They're just parroting things they heard from other people in order to sound cool to their peers, nothing more.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-20T02:19:16+00:00

A straight guy calling himself a lesbian and wanting to feel "like a woman"...

I bet that if she asks him about what "being a woman" is, some misogynist fetish shit is going to be the answer.

This is so predictable.

I wonder how he is able to fool himself.

Fetish.

His freaking fetish has rotten his brain to the point he doesn't even care about the amount of cognitive dissonance he has to engage on to keep up this facade to himself.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-16T02:46:57+00:00

The funniest thing of all is that even though they're doing their "best" to larp as a man, they still sounds like a 16 year old girl.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-16T02:44:39+00:00

There seems to be a pattern of wanting to date/hook up with people that won't reciprocate the feelings, is it just for validation? Wanting to exert power?

Yes, also fetish.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-14T17:20:28+00:00

Or the sex addicted.

Those exist too.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-07T15:36:04+00:00

Some people believe in the split attraction model to the point where they could say they are only sexually interested in the same sex and only romantically interested in the opposite sex...

That's called a friendship.

Any kind of romantic relationship requires some level of sexual intimacy, even if little. And "sexual intimacy" isn't necessarily full-on sex, as we all know.

Also, this whole "I don't want to have serious relationships with same-sex people" could be very well be interpreted as a desire of not being seen with a same-sex partner in public more than anything.

This "I'm romantically interested in women, but love to have sex with men" doesn't fly with most straight and even bi women, as they can only see themselves as being used as a beard for a guy in denial when faced with this kind of scenario.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-07T15:29:08+00:00

They want to feel different, and so, use mental illnesses as a way to present as different from others.

Let's face it: most of these "mental illness collectors" have lived very stable and confortable middle class lives, and so, need something in their lives to claim those sweet sweet opression points over.

They have no conception on the harsh realities of life or on how it truly feels to be disenfranchised or opressed.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-07T15:21:47+00:00

This is what years of consuming yaoi and novels written for straight women by straight women does to someone.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-09-07T15:20:35+00:00

I wonder why this is the case? Hmmmmm....

It's almost like they're a straight women, and as a straight women, they aren't interested in vaginas!

Nope! They're transphobic and must be reeducated, now!

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-29T04:34:29+00:00

cultural differences.

This is kind of a big deal, as many societies are organized based on gender and gender roles, western ones included.

The thing is: in many of these societies, gender isn't treated as a mere accessory or part of the personal identity of anyone, but just a product of biology and social standards.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-29T04:31:04+00:00

These kids want to belong.

They see queer groups as a kind of a social tribe, akin to the goths and emos of the 90s and 00s.

For most of them, being a gender special will be nothing more than a phase which they'll eventually move on from.

The problem here are the extreme cases: in the same way many people who jumped in the "drugs are cool" bandwagon of the 80s ended up frying their brains and ruining their lives beyond repair, there will be the ones who will do the same in regards to the "gender craze" of today.

Let's just hope there won't be many who decide to walk this path.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-29T04:22:22+00:00

Not like to a 13 year old, who is on Tumblr too much.

The problem is that many of those who participate on these "queer groups" have this exact mental age.

One evidence which points to this is how they go completely ballistic if they witness any semblance of opposition to their beliefs: instead of having a civil discussion, like most grown adults, they resort to histrionic screaming and flailing their arms like a toddler who was denied a toy.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T23:09:58+00:00

I do not, to be honest.

I hope they bring this word to the ground, where it belongs.

I have a very clear position on this whole "appropriating slurs" thing, which is a good and clear "no".

The first problem with this word is that it's so vague in meaning that it could theoretically be applied to anything "subversive", which is unhelpful at best and counterintuitive at worst.

Also, I personally thing that the first step in showing respect for oneself is to reject terms made to degrade and diminish oneself.

This might be a little radical, but eh... I believe it's appropriate.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T15:13:51+00:00

They start to question themselves, asking "Maybe I like girls (or guys) too?" or "Maybe I'm really a boy that's into boys?"

That's a good catch!

Why? Because this is also applied to gay and lesbian people and always was.

Oh, little Jimmy is more feminine than his peers? He must be a girl in disguise!

For years homosexuality was treated as some sort of "sexual inversion syndrome" closely related to sex "misidentification", so much so, that many efforts behind gay conversion therapy involved HRT.

If they can't change the attraction, they go for the body.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T15:07:01+00:00

I'm not surprised.

In proper time, most AGPs go T4T due to lack of options, as any well adjusted women won't tolerate such waste of space fetishists in their life.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T15:05:04+00:00

In short: they had the double mastectomy, but didn't want to do the hysterectomy, which resulted in some serious problems down the road.

What problems, you might be asking? Their uterus started to rot inside their body due to years of testosterone abuse, and so they nearly died because of it.

Yeah...

Buck narrated all of this in their social media, but I might try to go for a more detailed account of this later, because it's an interesting story, all things considered.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T05:29:18+00:00

Having bizarre sex doesn't make you more queer.

It's important to remember that "gay" and "queer" are not the same thing in this context.

The word "queer" is used as an umbrella term for a series of behaviors which break social standards and the notion of "normalcy" in general.

In this sense, a gay person can be "not queer" and a straight person can in theory be "queer".

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-25T05:25:30+00:00

Let's highlight this little comment here:

Gay spaces have a big transphobia problem. Our situations are different but our experiences are pretty similar, I'm non passing and ace and the few gay spaces that are around me feel completely alien, when they're not downright transphobic and hostile. It sucks technically belonging to a group but ending up being an outsider because of things out of my control. I wish I had a solution, but the only thing I can think of is a bigger push to address transphobia in cis gay guys, though I don't know if that will ever deal with the revulsion to certain body parts. Some people might say that's just a preference and not transphobia, but I think when that 'preference' is on such a wide scale something more is probably going on

It feels alien because you're trying to invade a space that is not made to cater to you.

You're not a gay men, my dear. Hell, you don't even self-id as gay! What are you even on about?!

Also, no amount of "activism" is going to make actual gay people feel attracted to you. At best some may feel sorry and pretend to find you hot, but they'll mock you behind closed doors.

That's how actual gay culture works.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T18:41:51+00:00

im a survivor of a lot of abuse and had to do an immense amount of work to reconnect with my body.

It really makes you think, doesn't it?

Also my terrible experiences dating straight men have made me buttshy.

Do I even need to say anything? lol

PIV feels fucking amazing to me it's one of my favorite sexual activities ngl.

I wonder why...

PIV i find the G spot a lot easier to ht than PIA.

I wonder why...

Also, I orgasm most easily from v penetration.

I wonder why

Getting rimmed literally feels like nothing or tickles. And it’s only successfully worked start to finish one time which was a complete fluke. Otherwise it’s torture.

It's because you don't have a prostate, my dear.

Many straight women absolutely hate anal sex for this exact reason: they feel little-to-nothing when doing it.

Most of them only do anal to appease their partners, that's it.

i’m extremely against anal intercourse (as a bottom only, i don’t top cause i feel uncomfy too), i just feel really uncomfortable, tried doing once with just a finger and it didn’t even hurt but i just didn’t get the point, too much work with little reward for me. i get extremely pleasured with PIV and i don’t have bottom dysphoria (only top)

This speaks for itself.

Every single comment in that thread is some flavor of "I prefer PiV because I feel nothing from anal" or "I love anal, so much so that I almost never do it" and even the occasional delusional "cis gay men prefer PiV".

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T18:29:15+00:00

I couldn't have said it better myself.

Whatever these people like it or not, Black communities tend to be way more conservative/traditionalist than the average White population.

This may even be valid for other ethinic groups in the US, like Latinos for example.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T04:50:02+00:00

When you read of boys abused by men it seems sometimes they have male sex partners but no mention of they were gay/bi to begin with.

The problem with those studies is thay they don't control for the "chicken or the egg" question, which is basicly: does same-sex sexual abuse turns straight men into gay men or are young gay men simply more vulnerable to abuse than their straight counterparts?

This is the one billion dollar question.

Personally, I think the second is more likely, as many young gay men tend to be more femine than their straight peers. Also, the fear of being outed by their abusers make them more likely to also not report being molested.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T04:45:00+00:00

The sexual abuse by same-sex would supposedly “cause” same sex attraction.

What is the logic of this? lol

Wouldn't same-sex abuse have the opposite effect, you know, by actually lowering any possible same-sex attraction on the victims?

The funny thing about this is that when the subject is women, these same people say the opposite: opposite-sex abuse turns women into lesbians.

They flip-flop on their beliefs based on convenience, not actual logic.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T04:34:34+00:00

The infantilization of grown ass adults is a signature characteristic of modern "queer activism".

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T04:31:00+00:00

Let's see what we have here:

Q: When do you feel the most queer?

A: Right now, I mean, look at my outfit! And last night, when I made out with a random girl. The feeling gets stronger with each passing day, and I love it.

So being queer is about consumerism and having bad taste in dresses, apparently.

At Christmas dinner with a bunch of straight people, I’ve been asked if I was a top or a bottom. That was an invasion of privacy. In those moments, I thought, “Shut up lady, I don’t ask you about your straight sex life.”

I can't blame her, really.

This shit is so normalized in certain "queer" groups that this person probably thought that being really invasive about his sex life was not only fine, but also a good way of showing her comfort with "queer culture".

Q: What’s the most queer thing you’ve ever done?

A: [Laughs] I’m thinking of an extreme sex story, because it went against all heteronormative standards, but I’ll keep the details to myself.

This is the same person who said the quote above, by the way.

You're not helping your case, buddy.

If you base your whole identity around sex, don't be surprised if people around you think that bringing up the subject all the time is a good way to be friendly to you.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-24T03:16:24+00:00

At this point, the Stonewall riots are more akin to mythology than an actual historic event.

I mean, even Marsha declared time and time again they arrived at the event only after the rioting already started, but who cares, right?

Also, this whole "think of the black transwomen" concern trolling is a sham, as most items in the transactivist agenda are geared towards a very white and very middle class audience.

Everyone knows that the main problem that black transwomen face today is prostitution, but these fucks never touch on this topic.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker · 2023-08-20T23:54:23+00:00

Probably living their standard, "boring" lives, as many of us do.

Neo_Shadow_Lurker