all 27 comments

[–]Vigte 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

I was also wondering this - it seemed REALLY fake, AT THAT POINT - everything else was messed up and seemed very real :(

[–]magnora7[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Yeah I guess sometimes reality acts in unexpected ways. I had the same reaction. I mean I've never seen a man try to shoot a shotgun through a front windshield, so I guess I didn't think about the difference between laminated glass vs tempered glass (which is what the side window was made of and why it exploded). The lamination just mean the bullets punch small holes instead of shattering the whole thing, apparently. I learned that today.

[–]OMG_WTF_WOW 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I saw this post this morning, and finally watched the whole video.

I knew, of course that windshields are made of laminated glass (two layers of glass with a strong plastic film sandwiched between, to prevent shattering), but watching an re-watching the video, I could not reconcile the fact that, though there was certainly "shock damage" to the windshield, I could not see any holes.

I spent way too much time today trying to figure it out, running and re-running the post-mosque segments, trying to see any actual holes in the windscreen as the perp drove through light and shadow.

Contrast these two sets of images (sorry, the files are huge, need to be cut into segments for better detail visibility).

Screen shots from the NZ mad man's windshield shots:

vs screen shots from US police officers shooting through their windshields at suspects:

At the bottom of the second image, there is a demo of what happens to a car windshield when hit by 00 buckshot (9+ pieces of lead, each of which is nearly as large as a 9mm slugs fired by sidearms typically carried by US LEO's.

The NZ shooter fired at least three shots toward his windshield. It is visibly damaged, cracked, pitted, and perhaps delaminated, but I'll be damned if I can see any HOLES in the windshield that would necessarily be there if he were firing live 12 gauge rounds at point blank.

As to the side window, as you mentioned, it is tempered glass, specifically designed to shatter into blunt, relatively harmless fragments rather than sharp shards.

A simple pebble kicked up by a passing car can totally destroy a tempered glass window. Then again, so could the shock wave of a 12 gauge (or the wad) if fired at point blank range.

Watching the video gave me serious déjà vu feelings, like I had after 9/11/2001 - building 7, etc.

Something doesn't feel right here, and seeing the megacorps scrub the videos fast and furious does not give an added sense of security.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I only saw a hole/cracked spot after the 3rd shot to the front windshield. And you can see that spot clearly in your images of him driving aftereward. I really cannot see ones from the first two shots though. I just chalk it up to the video quality, and also maybe they were misfires or something because he physically pulls a stuck cartridge out at one point it looks like after the first 2, rather than just ejecting it normally. So I think the first 2 were misfires? Thanks for the detailed analysis, it is rather odd and still maybe worth thinking about.

[–]nirv 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Watch a youtube video on your cell phone and lose all the details that you'd see on a nice 30" IPS monitor. Instead of the video being fake, how about all of the equipment used from the guy's camera to whatever you're viewing the video on are absolute shit?

Ooops. Wouldn't want to cut right through the bullshit and get straight to reality.

Edit: Yeah. saidit is sure fucking awesome when it has just as TERRIBLE limitations as reddit does. FUCK your typing limitations you SHITTY website. You're not a good enough alternative yet. Get rid of this stupid "you're doing that too much"

[–]Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

No need to get so mad.

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

When he shot the women her arm looks like it exploded but the firearm wasn't even aimed their. But then it looks like he shot her in the head and he did drive over her, so that also gives credibility to it being real. It looks real and probably is. But if it's fake then it is some of the best fake footage I've seen in a long time. The only thing I found odd at first was when he first went in to the building and it looked like everyone was turning their face away from the gun. As if the gun was firing training rounds that leave a welt but do not kill. I think he used real ones though and indeed people died.

[–]fred_red_beans 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Windshields are made with a laminate on them so that they don't shatter when impacted. He could be running slugs instead of birdshot through his shotgun, so when shooting through the windshield, it easily pierces right through. Although video quality is low, I do observe cracking around the area where he shot through. Looks like what would happen when shooting through a windshield. I've hit one before and cracks were localized to the impact area. The long cracks you see in windshields generally occur over time due to thermal cycling.

[–]nirv 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

God you guys are pissing me off - I created an account just to tell you this.

  1. His camera really blows.

  2. The angle (or fish eye type view) we have isn't going to easily show the holes.

  3. It's not fake. There are ACTUALLY holes in the window. It's a real gun and it put holes in his window.

Don't ever fucking rely on shitty cameras to tell you the whole story. Haven't you ever taken video with your cellphone in sunlight? Not every single detail shows up. Shit blends together. The guy seemed to have been using some really low quality stream settings, too, which it why the video looks not much better than fucking SEGA 32X CD FMV (full motion video) from the 90s.

Windshields don't always shatter like the side window did.

More SHIT photos, but here's one when he was arrested. You can clearly see the damage.

Come on guys. Get it the fuck together. Wait for higher resolution pictures of the car and you'll clearly fucking see it.

tl;dr fucking shit camera, codec settings, and lighting to see the shotgun bullet holes, but they are there. This isn't some conspiracy fakeness; pick up a Carl Sagan book for a change and learn about reality. YEAH! FUCKING REALITY!

[–]magnora7[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I'm not sure why you're so angry, when in the comments I was already clearly convinced of this long ago... People can take an opinion based on little information they have, and then change that opinion when more information comes out. Like I did.

You're not wrong, but just calm down. You're already preaching the choir but not realizing it. Asking questions is the whole point of this site, you can't flip a shit everytime someone asks a question you don't like lol.

I agree with you, no reason to be upset mate. I was just asking questions based on the info I had at the time. I even posted a comment about how I was thinking about deleting this post now that my question was resolved... People aren't so stupid and against you as you seem to think man

[–]Vigte 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah he left me a nice little diddy in here too - complaining at me about "get rid of the "You are posting too much" thing" - I guess I'm a site owner now! Yay!

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

All 4 of his comments/posts he made since joining the site are like super duper angry

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I know this is from 4chan and all, but this looks very odd:

[–]hennaojisan 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

I also wondered what the hell he was doing at that point, but afterwards, I thought there were bullet holes low and to the left of the windshield. I think windscreens nowadays are designed to take a blow or gunshot without shattering completely. Also, the sound of any gun being fired inside a car would be deafening. I am going with the hoax theory anyway. The bodies didn't look real and there were no people running around as I would expect. Did you notice all the words and symbols on the weapons? As someone said, this was memes inside memes, inside memes. Expect to see bans on anything that can possibly be labeled as hate speech on the Internet starting right away.

[–]magnora7[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

I thought there were bullet holes low and to the left of the windshield. I think windscreens nowadays are designed to take a blow or gunshot without shattering completely.

Yeah that's very possible, and then the cracks just don't show up well on the low-quality video.

People were definitely running right when he came in to the mosque, he shot like 4 in the back that were clearly trying to run away. They were the first people shot.

Yeah there's so many things written on those guns, it'd be interesting to read all of it.

I agree it does seem orchestrated to shut down "hate speech" and limit the parts of the internet those in power don't like. I also think all those people died, I was full of doubts but watching the video closely convinced me, especially when he shot the woman laying in the curb toward the end. I don't know you would fake that, her body partially explodes open and there's clearly blood.

I think it was orchestrated by intelligence agencies to limit free speech, by a right wing nutjob who was brainwashed/goaded in to acting like this by those intelligence agencies, maybe not even realizing it was them or why they were doing it. I think it was probably orchestrated to some degree, but I also think 49 people died.

They don't mind killing people to get more power. Why risk the operation by relying on actors, especially when there's video? They're psychos, they've proven they'll kill to get what they want.

[–]hennaojisan 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

The group of intel organizations called The Five Eyes includes both New Zealand and Australia as well as the usual suspects. They all work closely together. The woman in the gutter is hard to explain but it could have been shot several times and the most authentic-looking one spliced in. I missed some details because I could only watch it once. Yes, maybe blanks and what I saw was powder burns.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

authentic-looking one spliced in.

To a live stream? I dunno.

Definitely agree on the five eyes thing, NZ intelligence is totally compromised. And they may have been influencing the shooter in more ways than one. But I still think 49 real people really got killed today, I think the video makes that clear, having spent almost all day analyzing it. I missed some details too like blood pools and stuff that on re-watch made me realize it was almost certainly real. And my concerns about the windshield not shattering were assuaged too when people explained how laminated glass is different from the tempered glass the side windows use.

I'm like 99% convinced it was real people really dying. But I also think it was probably an orchestrated false flag, and this guy was knowingly or unknowingly a patsy to that. But I think he did kill those people for real.

[–]hennaojisan 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Could what looked like a live feed be prepared beforehand? It would take some coordination but seems possible. Partly live, partly before? I'm no expert on that so my question is genuine.

[–]magnora7[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It could be, but it's unlikely and would be way more difficult imo. There were real victims, and the arrest video was shot by a bystander. It's possible, but unlikely imo

[–]hennaojisan 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I am not necessarily disagreeing with you about "real victims" but my overall impression was it was stagey.

[–]Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

At Parkland PSYOP, a lot of the witnesses story interviews were recorded years before. One student was in College at the time but said she was in the freshman building and a student, the one who was smiling the night of the shooting, saying she saw Cruz and at that time her best friend allegedly died in the shooting and the names were already released but she wasn't even concerned, plus she graduated the year before. She looks so much younger in the news video than she does in any of her social media posts just weeks after.

So, yes in many PSYOPs they plan years in advance and pick the right days to mold all the narrative, and conflicting timelines together. They can record videos well in advance and then send them to news agencies. Ambiguity, and conflicting information is key that way people can not come to a coherent conclusion.

So, they are planning many more PSYOPs, not saying the NZ shootign was fake or anything because it sure looks real but PSYOPS are planend years in advance and the crisis management groups train for them under national security clauses.

[–]Jesus 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The women looked like she was shot in the head but the first shot where her arm explodes is not even where the gun is pointed.

[–]hennaojisan 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Good. I am not convinced either way yet on this one but based on "shootings" in the past it is difficult not to be skeptical.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Good observation Magnora.

Here's a video of a police officer shooting through his windshield..
The first shot produced a large hole in the glass, and huge cracks across the entire windshield. Subsequent shots produced more cracks, and holes.

Side windows shatter into hundreds of tiny pieces in impact. This shattering is intentionally designed into auto side windows. They don't keep their shape at all, so I'd expect the impact from the interior to shatter it.

That shotgun was almost certainly shooting blanks, so it didn't crack the windshield. Especially, given the accumulated of powder deposits on the windshield where the shots are fired. I bet it was loud in that car.

A couple of additional unusual details:

  • I would expect to see much, much, more blood. Most of the blood appeared when the victims were off screen, as well. A little blood smears and stains everything. The people who were shot in the beginning and can be seen quickly crawling away should have created huge blood smears across the carpet where they crawled. No blood was evident along the path of movement. The green carpet didn't help, though.
  • The guy left the building and came back in; even though there didn't appear to be any additional victims.
  • Leaving would create an opportunity for people inside to spread blood, etc. He also got rid of the flashing light, which affected the video clarity (possibly intentionally).
  • The man who appeared to rush the shooter didn't show signs of blood. He was shot multiple times within 10 feet. There should have been multiple exit wounds, and blood sprayed radially on surfaces in the direction of the exit wounds (walls, floor, etc.).
  • He must have had an original GoPro, because the video quality was absurdly bad. 240 resolution bad. Intentionally bad. Money for guns, but not a decent camera.
  • The crappy film quality is likely intended to make it difficult to identify inconsistencies. This is the opposite of what we should expect from a psychopath who wanted to video record the savage details of a massacre.

[–]magnora7[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Maybe of the 3 shots were 2 misfires, followed by a 3rd shot that only fractured the glass in one small area (as front windshields are designed to do) but didn't go through, so he started shooting out the side window, which shatters because it's made of a different type of glass.

I almost want to delete this thread because I no longer agree with my original question as pointing to anything useful, but I'll leave it up I guess. I'm 99% sure the 49 people that died were real people who actually died, I was just confused on this windshield part and it struck me as odd

[–]SundogsPlace 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

My thoughts on real, or fake, I don't know. I do believe this was a created false flag; 'as seen on tv'.

The take away to myself? No one can ever stop any determined thinking individual until a good 'impact' of whatever sort is had.... It simply cannot be done. Take the guns, then it'll be improvised munitions as seen made in the Soviet block, Ireland, and elsewhere in the UK.

The only means to keep people safe, is through liberty, and being armed. A gun will stop an event before it gets started simply by placing your hand on it, and stating these words, 'I'm armed, and I will defend myself, stop'. Aside from that, any weapon, even a walking cane can mean the difference between being a real living freedom breathing mean machine that sees another day, and/or ending up like a pile of dead folks in a mosque, real, or not. Just saying.

[–]Jesus 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Looks very real but this looks weird. I say it's real. If I witness a kangaroo court and duping delight at the funerals if they even broadcast it, then I'll ask myself how they were able to make it look so real but to me, right now, it's real.