DiscussionExtreme Homophobia on Ovarit (the norm)

submitted by stunaep from self.LGBDropTheT

sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun
you are viewing a single comment's thread.

view the rest of the comments →

[–][deleted] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I see a lot of misandry, which is normal and comes with the territory.

It is? Normal for radfems, you mean?

Yes, from what I've seen. They are critically analyzing how women have been oppressed - which is good! But that also means in certain ways, they are now the oppressors, as mens views should not have validity due to the tainted patriarchy which created the structure. If a woman brings up something positive about men, or ways that men are suffering under current society, it's dismissed as succumbing to the patriarchy ("not my Nigel", LibFem pandering, etc etc), and the user is slowly ousted from the community.

I learned that there is a difference between being gender critical (critical of gender) vs being GenderCritical (RadFem). It's important to distinguish between that. I respect what my GC/RF sisters are going for, but I don't support many of their perspectives, too extreme for me. I have a brother, a father, a grandfather, a nephew, and several male friends - I want them to have equality too, and not just be products of a sick nurtured society. I want them to be aware of and accountable for their individual actions, and learn to grow beyond gender roles and societal pressures, which means not blaming or shaming them for being men.

We can call-out negative stereotypes without segregation. We can teach without bullying. We can fight homophobia without pitting lesbians against gay men. I think many people in the GC movement are more like me, critical of gender, not necessarily GC/RF.

[–]yousaythosethingsFind and Replace "gatekeeping" with "having boundaries" 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I endorse pretty much everything you’re saying way more articulately than I could throughout this thread. I don’t subscribe wholesale or outsource my thinking to any ideology. Extremism and divisiveness are a turn off to me. I genuinely want to understand others’ positions and make sense out of them, not engage in posturing while we talk past each other. I think this place has a good balance because there is widespread recognition that a lot of us are coming from different places and have different priorities but there is mutual respect for the ability to have these different perspectives despite our one common belief being that LGB people and our institutions should not be forced into gender identity ideology.

[–]reluctant_commenter 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It is? Normal for radfems, you mean?

Yes, from what I've seen.

Sorry, I should have clarified: I misread you as implying that misandry is normal in general. I'm unfortunately well aware that it's normal among radfems, lol.

I learned that there is a difference between being gender critical (critical of gender) vs being GenderCritical (RadFem).

Yes, that's very true. But the two are so often conflated that I avoid even calling myself "gender critical" in the non-radfem sense.

I think many people in the GC movement are more like me, critical of gender, not necessarily GC/RF.

I sure hope so. I've interacted with self-described "gender critical" groups on other accounts before, though, and while some people certainly are as you describe-- and I don't want to alienate those people!-- some really are pretty classic radical feminists, many of whom are quite homophobic.

I think there's just not enough awareness of our pro-LGB movement, at least here in the US, for people to realize that there are alternatives to the GC movement. I lurk on TumblrInAction, and it seems like users on there are always surprised when someone mentions pro-LGB sentiment and community.

We can fight homophobia without pitting lesbians against gay men.

Absolutely. And without pitting lesbian women against bisexual people... I know I probably sound like a broken record, but I try hard to call out radical feminist homophobia/biphobia whenever I see it because I think it's an extremely effective way of putting a wedge in LGB communities. Not to mention-- some, but not all, self-described radfem "lesbians" are "political lesbians" and not even actual lesbian women... so they're not helping us, either.