Feeling guilt

submitted by Skipdip from self.GenderCritical

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[–]Metis 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

For me being gender critical and not believing in trans ideology isn't so much about whether gender dysphoria is innate or natural. I have no problem believing that some people suffer from it and are happier presenting as the other gender. Whether they are born with it or it's due to social contagion or a mixture of both I can't say for sure. However, being male or female is still a matter of biology as much as your skin color, hair color or whatever else is coded in your DNA is. What I'm sceptical of is the claim that sex is somehow the only biological catagory where the concept that people are born in a wrong body is valid and the only course of action is to alter your body accordingly. Transitioning to another race for example is completely unacceptable and I've seen people claiming to feel like they belong to another race made fun of. The same goes for people with Body Integrity disorder (a mental condition where people want to be amputees, they refer to themselves as transabled). Let's see what wikipedia has to say about treatment for BID: “There is no evidence-based treatment for BID; there are reports of the use of cognitive behavioral therapy and antidepressants.“ Somehow no one is denying these people's existence or literally killing them by denying their wish to mutilate their bodies and live as their “authentic self“. Even though they would actually become amputees if we applied the same treatment as we did with gender dysphoria and therefore they wouldn't have to force people to believe they were actual amputees. And don't get me started on trans species which is becoming more acceptable than people wanting to get rid of their limbs? It's all completely arbitrary and it sounds highly illogical to me that one person claiming to be born in the wrong body should be believed and supported while the other is made fun of when both are solely based on feelings that are not verifiable parameters in reality.

Now, let's assume some people indeed are born in the wrong body and accept that the best course of action is to let them transition. Why does believing that one can help these people by letting them transition necessarily mean that one must also believe that trans people are really and have always been the sex they claim to be? Because that's what I have a massive problem with - forcing others to share their belief that they actually can change sex and become the other sex and are no different from the sex they claim to be. I can verify whether someone is male or female because it is a biological reality whereas the other is only a mental reality of some people. Why does the mental reality of some people believing they really are the opposite sex trump biological reality? Why am I considered hateful and transphobic if I don't share their belief and pretend that our realities are not only completely the same but also support the erasure of my sex in everything that is related to female biology. And why is no one concerned with renaming men as ejaculators and penis-havers, why are only females and female spaces targeted? Furthermore, the sex segregated spaces we have are exactly that - sex segregated because it makes sense in terms of anatomy and biology. Abolishing these spaces in order to come off as politically correct should not be more important than protecting the people for whom they were made and who need them.

I think GC people don't have a problem with trans people but the ideology that comes with it that is misogynistic and based on outdated gender roles. I've grown really tired of people claiming their desire for wearing pink tutus is as much evidence of their womanhood as women menstruating or giving birth and therefore they should be included in spaces that are dedicated to functions of the female bodies (breastfeeding groups etc.)

Also, I am not an expert but have been very interested in the Lakota from an early age and I just want to add that a winkte was never considered a woman. They had a completely seperate role from women and no woman could have ever become a winkte and vice versa. So it's not really the same thing as being a trans woman today because no one forced anyone to believe that winktes were actually women.

[–]MarkTwainiac 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Now, let's assume some people indeed are born in the wrong body

But why assume this even for the sake of argument? How on earth can someone be born in the wrong body?

This daft idea of being born in the wrong body only make sense to those who have no clue about how human conception occurs and what happens afterwards during implantation in the uterine wall, followed by all the various stages of embryonic and fetal development over the next 40 weeks, followed by all the millions of things that happen during the long course of infant and child development, puberty and adolescence. How babies are made and what happens to infants, children and adolescents as they grow into adulthood are not mysteries. It's all been well studied and well documented.

The human brain, neurological system and reproductive organs develop along with all the rest of the body. Development of brain, mind and body are all of a piece. Coz we are our bodies. We don't exist as disembodied minds apart from our bodies. And every one of the cells in our bodies from the time we are conceived until after we die contains our sex chromosomes. If we are buried and our bones are dug up centuries later, our sex will be still be clear from the shape of the pelvis and our DNA.

[–]Skipdip[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah i think this is the underlying thing that gets me. I am a bodyworker-in-training (cranial osteopathy/BCST and somatic therapy for repairing early/developmental trauma and attachment dysfunction). No matter how accepting I try to be, at the end of the day there is something I just can’t let go: mind/body split.

There is nothing inherent about it. It is a mental illness, a wounding. Having numerous “mental illnesses” myself (as you’ve probably intuited from my posts haha). I don’t think the term is actually beneficial or accurate when describing these compensatory patterns of suffering. “Mental illness” in itself implies a mind/body split. Kathy Kain describes this psyche/soma split as a foundational wound in our culture.

[–]Skipdip[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Ok yes! ESP about that winke point. I actually had a phase of being highly interested and self-studying Native American and tribal indigenous cultures in general. I read extensively from the Native American Renaissance and played around with learning a bit of Inuit and Lakota. These alternative cultures in tune with the sacred feminine really gave me hope that we can return to that type of way... a world in which women can literally be naked and it’s fine. I recently went to verify this as well, the bugis and some other cultures that I briefly skimmed over... first off I haven’t ever seen a culture that had a role for “lesbian” mtfs or “gay” ftms. There is no precedence for this.

Secondly, like you said, I saw no precedent for any of these “trans” roles actually being considered the opposite sex: a winkte is not a woman, neither is a calalai, etc. Buck Angel hit the nail on the head in a recent tweet “a transgender woman is a transgender woman”.

Thirdly, most cultures with more “gender” roles have a role for a feminine homosexual male... this includes the Lakota, please correct me if I’m wrong but I never heard of ftms in Lakota culture. Far fewer also have a separate role for masculine homosexual females. In many cultures this ftm role is a way women can get around limitations and oppression (calabai can go out at night and take “man” jobs).

Lastly, until very recently any tribal culture with any “extra genders” had no access to medical transition whatsoever. That must have really changed the whole game, as our modern trans movement has sprung entirely from our plastic surgery technology. I feel like that is a big thing people are taking for granted.

My personal assessment of many native cultures is that the goal was the actualización of the individual. Some things were separated by sex, but “gender” wasn’t a limitation for people the way it is in our patriarchal culture. The culture existed to facilitate the actualización of each individuals unique gifts. Even if it was a backwards person who does everything backwards. They understood that if everyone is bringing their gifts, the groups has abundance.

I feel like when genderists are looking at these cultures they are doing it from our consciousness, not the consciousness that was actually present in these cultures. Considering that in these cultures, people were so connected to the sacred feminine and embodied, hunters could sense a seal was killed when it was too far away to even see.

Anyway a bunch of good points you have. There is an erasure of women/females going on, and honestly I think the biggest reason men aren’t having the same this, is because women hate being seen as women. It’s really women pushing this tbh. It’s sad.

A lot of trans men are showing up in my dating apps. Hell, I wish I could flip a switch and live as a man. But yeah I’ve been trying to connect to my poom and have been reading this book “Pussy”. It’s been quite emotional accepting this feminine part of myself that I’ve been ashamed of so long. I’m trying to do the work of undoing the effects of patriarchy, which involves opening up and feeling a lot of really painful stuff. It involves... embracing the (sacred) feminine! gasp. Here I am emphasizing my masculine parts and not wanting anything to do with “femininity”. I just feel that TIFs have shut off from that, which is totally ok because it’s really difficult and overwhelming... but sad, and it’s no wonder women feel betrayed by trans men.