QT: What rights don’t trans people have?

submitted by wokuspokus from self.GCdebatesQT

sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun
you are viewing a single comment's thread.

view the rest of the comments →

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 7 insightful - 6 fun7 insightful - 5 fun8 insightful - 6 fun -  (22 children)

I think Biden wants to help trans people genuinely but doesn’t actually understand the issues we face personally.

My preference is single occupancy neutral spaces since dedicated trans facilities would necessarily out those using them and stealth is a trans woman’s best protection from persecution.

Trans women can’t compete With men and given that athletes are specifically the hyper masculine and insecure men most likely to hurt us, shouldn’t even if they could. I’m not convinced we have no edge over natal women so I don’t advocate for that either. No trans women in sports is the best solution I’ve found even though I quite value sport personally. I power lift for example but don’t compete, even though my numbers wouldn’t be particularly impressive among natal women.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

Why can’t transwomen compete with men?

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (18 children)

We are hopelessly outclassed with proper testosterone suppression. It’s rendered a noncontest. In addition the likelihood of targeted injury isn’t acceptable.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

So you could but you think they wouldn’t stand a chance.

But there’s nothing in place that actually prevents transwomen from competing against other males? No laws or restrictions, just… not wanting to lose (and wanting the validation of the women’s sports)?

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (15 children)

No we can’t compete. We could attempt but it wouldn’t be competition. High school teams don’t compete with pro tams. It’s the same. There is no contest.

But there’s nothing in place that actually prevents transwomen from competing against other males?

The integrity of sport and hostility of the masculine men. Safety. Many things. But there is usually no rule. Sometimes there is for instance the USAPL banned trans women from all competition not just against natal women.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

So yes, technically speaking, you could in fact compete, you just don’t think you stand a chance at winning and are worried about a few hypotheticals. (With the exception of the USAPL)

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 3 insightful - 7 fun3 insightful - 6 fun4 insightful - 7 fun -  (11 children)

Part of competition involves contest. It’s not sport for a trans woman to get destroyed by a cis dude. It’s Bullying with a ball. It isn’t sport.

[–]kwallio 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

And what about women competing with transwomen? Its no fun for them either. Bullying with a ball basically sums up women competing with transwomen.

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 3 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 5 fun4 insightful - 6 fun -  (0 children)

I’m openly against us competing against natal women. I’ve made that clear.

[–]MarkTwainiac 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It’s not sport for a trans woman to get destroyed by a cis dude. It’s Bullying with a ball. It isn’t sport.

But according to you it's perfectly fine for males who identify as trans to beat the pants off female athletes. Gotcha. This is just the same old, same old male supremacy in a new guise.

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 2 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 4 fun3 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

What are you talking about? I’m against trans women competing against natal women.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

So yes, TW can compete against other males they just don’t want to becuse they think they’ll lose. We can keep going back and forth but this is the answer to my question lol

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 3 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 5 fun4 insightful - 6 fun -  (5 children)

No. They could share a field but couldn’t compete more than your high school basketball team could compete against the Nicks.

With some exceptions there’s no rule against it but it serves none of the purposes of sport. It isn’t a competition. It doesn’t provide physical benefit or comraderie or fun. It isn’t ethically similar to a sport. It’s an echo of a sport. Like the globetrotters pretending to play the generals.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I understand that, I’m not even saying you’re wrong- but they can still technically play even if there’s no point and it sucks all the fun out of the game, that’s my only point. That there isn’t really anything preventing them from being allowed to compete against other males if they didn’t want to give up sports to “transition”

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Depends on "transness" of that transgender person and how deep self-ID has gotten. As was noted previously - Hubbard would still be top 15%, which is above 85% of the male competitors...

In Canada, for example, non-binary male transgender can compete in both male and female team at same time, without any hormones, surgeries or anything. Just your regular manly male bloke: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/E4plrHvWYAAWcEl?format=jpg&name=medium

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (0 children)

I’m talking about hormone controlled trans women. They can’t compete. I’m not saying we should compete against natal women, I’m saying we can’t compete against men.

[–]MarkTwainiac 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This is BS.

[–]wokuspokus[S] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I think we’re pretty much in agreement tbh. I hope the housing/healthcare situation gets sorted out for you.

[–]circlingmyownvoid2 6 insightful - 6 fun6 insightful - 5 fun7 insightful - 6 fun -  (0 children)

Thanks.