GC: Why is there more focus on trans women than trans men?

submitted by GenderbenderShe/her/hers from self.GCdebatesQT

sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun
you are viewing a single comment's thread.

view the rest of the comments →

[–]MarkTwainiac 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I believe in free speech in the conventional sense. When most people say free speech, they mean consequences for their speech should not come from the government.

On this thread you've bragged about the role you've played in getting women who disagree with you

banned from reddit.

Reddit being "the front page of the internet" and one of most popular social media sites in the world by far.

Sorry, such views & actions do not indicate that you "believe in free speech in the conventional sense." They say the opposite, in fact.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 4 insightful - 6 fun4 insightful - 5 fun5 insightful - 6 fun -  (8 children)

On this thread you've bragged about the role you've played in getting women who disagree with you

I did participate in r/gendercynical, but I merely pointed out AFAB people (including myself) were also instrumental in getting GC subs banned. By the way, Reddit is a private-owned site and can make their own rules. Free speech merely refers to the government.

[–]Penultimate_Penance 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Free speech as a principle should matter for society at large. If someone can lose their job, receive death & rape threats for not agreeing with the status quo of the day their free speech isn't very free is it? The status quo will change. It always does and one day you may very well be on the wrong end of it.

The Trans Activists are the McCarthyists of this generation. Authoritarians are the enemy of pluralistic societies and suppression of dissent is one of their classic mo's. Trans activists are very much so repeating history albeit in a unique way thanks to modern medicine. All it will take is for enough people to say enough! For it all to come crumbling down.

Remember that the people who are suppressed the most by authoritarians are disenfranchised groups like women & minorities, which is why suppressing free speech by mob rule is a fucking big deal. Women have been shouted down as long as we have written history. Your lot is just more of the same misogyny. Trans activism is regressive, your lot has got the fundy conservative Christians beat for viciousness. Screaming at women and telling them to shut up or else isn't a pretty look. Anyone who sends rape and death threats isn't fit to be a member of society. They failed at the bare minimum of basic human decency.

"Have you no sense of decency?"

Threatening people's employment, because they disagree with you is unacceptable. People need money to live, to support their families and trans activists act shocked that people are fighting back against them. Of course there is going to be pushback. We should be free to speak are minds and fight for our rights without being attacked by the braying mob of the day.

Would you like it if a bunch of bigots banned every trans sub on reddit? Would you like it if 100s perhaps even 1000s of people tried to get you fired, because you said something in support of trans activism they didn't like? Would you like it if you were sent death & rape threats, if you were assaulted for advocating for trans rights? Really think about this. Who are the bullies here? Who are the oppressors? Who are the tyrants?

Bigotry Definition: "stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own."

In this debate who are the bigots? I'd say it's the group of people who suppress any speech that they don't like. Suppression includes banning subs you don't like from the public square of our modern age. The public square includes platforms like reddit, twitter, facebook etc.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (6 children)

Free speech as a principle should matter for society at large. If someone can lose their job, receive death & rape threats for not agreeing with the status quo of the day their free speech isn't very free is it? The status quo will change. It always does and one day you may very well be on the wrong end of it.

I do not believe people should receive death & rape threats, but employers are already allowed to fire employees for hate speech on their personal social media, like racist and sexist speech. Why should transphobic speech be different? If you think people shouldn't be fired for transphobic speech, that's fine. But that also means people shouldn't be fired for racist and sexist speech outside of work.

Would you like it if a bunch of bigots banned every trans sub on reddit? Would you like it if 100s perhaps even 1000s of people tried to get you fired, because you said something in support of trans activism they didn't like?

Then I'd use another site and boycott reddit. Reddit is a private company and can do what they please.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

So if I chose not to sell items in my store to transwomen, I’m not in the wrong because I’m a private business?

I suspect you’d call me a bigot if I did that.

[–]Penultimate_Penance 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

People should be free to say whatever they want in their private lives. Workplaces should not be allowed to compel their employees speech outside of working hours. That is insane. I wouldn't dream of trying to get a forced birther fired. I vehemently disagree with them, but I think they have just as much a right to earn an honest living as I do unmolested by braying mobs of zealots. You need to understand that everyone, absolutely everyone believes they are in the right. We need damn good hard ground rules for what is unacceptable suppression of free speech on the governmental level and the social level. If the religious zealots come into power again people could lose their jobs for saying they don't believe in god. The examples are endless. Forcing one groups personal beliefs on the rest of society is unacceptable period.

[–]ZveroboyAlinaIs clownfish a clown or a fish? 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If the religious zealots come into power again people could lose their jobs for saying they don't believe in god.

14 islamic countries still have such laws, and at least in 6 of them this can end up with death penalty for a non-believer or a believer in another god than theirs.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 6 fun1 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 6 fun -  (2 children)

People should be free to say whatever they want in their private lives. Workplaces should not be allowed to compel their employees speech outside of working hours.

I agree for the most part. I just think we shouldn't treat different forms of hate speech differently. If employers are allowed to fire people for racist and sexist speech, why should transphobic speech be treated different? Though yes people should be allowed to use hate speech without getting fired unless their job directly deals with people's welfare. If a judge goes on a racist rant on Facebook, you might wonder if he's giving higher sentences to black and brown defendants for the same crime. Granted, there should be oversight of these things anyway, like an independent commission making sure everyone gets a fair sentence and removing judges from the bench who don't practice this

That is insane. I wouldn't dream of trying to get a forced birther fired. I vehemently disagree with them, but I think they have just as much a right to earn an honest living as I do unmolested by braying mobs of zealots.

On an unrelated note, thank you for using the term forced birther. For anti-abortionists I use the term pro-birth instead of pro-life for anti-abortionists. If they really were about life, these same people would also be advocating for the best health care, for livable wages, for OTC birth control so you wouldn't need an abortion, for police reform, increasing the quality of education, and reducing poverty. But they're not. They just want the kid born. But when the kid is born, these same people complain about single mothers, mothers on welfare because you're always supposed to pull yourself up by the bootstraps and no matter what situation you find yourself in it's entirely your fault. The pro-birth movement was never about life. It's about misogyny and shaming women for their choices.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It’s not hate speech to say males are men and females are women.

[–]Penultimate_Penance 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Employers shouldn't be allowed to fire people for racist or sexist speech in their private lives either. All private speech should be protected. What is considered racist or sexist is extremely subjective. The same for transphobia. Women have been fired for saying men are not women. That is batshit.