Looking for both trans and GC people to work towards stopping predators from accessing our respective spaces

submitted by [deleted] from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (19 children)

Ovarit has stated since the beginning that they accept men, I don't believe they were ever barred from joining. And I suppose I'll have to take your word on the rest, and I'm going to have to just take all of our GC member's word that they're GC radfems. I mean, they can check out this thread and see your opinions on them and respond if they want, maybe they'll say they're libfems after all but it's not really my place to accuse them of being anything other than what they say they are.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

I’m gonna laugh really really hard at anyone who tries to say they are a radical feminist or any kind of feminist whilst arguing for male privileges or for women to fight for males to get anything.

It’s as easy for hardcore qt folks to call themselves gc/a feminist/radfem as it is for males to say they are really girls. Taking someone at their word on the internet is unadvised.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Because trans ideology issue became so big, affecting whole society and is hurting kids - gender critical does not mean being gender critical feminist or being gender critical radical feminist anymore. One can be conservative christian gender critical misogynist, for example.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Yeah, but radfem is a lot more well defined that just ‘critical of gender’. GCfeminism at least clears up the idea that anyone here really supports conservative old ideas.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I am reading Ovarit time to time, and it does not look like exclusively radfem space, it is more like "place moderated by few radfems".

GCfeminism at least clears up the idea that anyone here really supports conservative old ideas.

Valid point.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Wow ovarit is just a total waste of time then. Only signed up cause I thought it was by radfems for radfem leaning females. Might as well be Reddit if they’re gonna have groups where males can round up women to fix their problems with the men’s room.

I’m trying to drop gc from my vocab tbh. Gotten meaningless.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It is still in majority of posts is focused on feminism and women problems. I think they said that they wanted to create safe space for women and radical feminists, where they can voice their opinions and talk freely, originally, I don't know what they are planning to do now. And I haven't seen there anything pro-trans or pro-transsexual. Maybe they mean their Discord?

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

We created our own space on Zulip. Ovarit would never have us, I wasn't even going to try to suggest anything take place there. If anyone thinks they've gone soft, they've made sure to let me know they don't like having me there. Same with trans subs on Reddit, I did ask them but they wouldn't have it. We're really working on the predator problem is what our group is discussing, it's not a GCdebatesQT sort of group as it's focused on our mutual views.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (11 children)

I guess that's your prerogative! Not really sure what more I can say on that, it's beyond my depth. Also I appreciate the advice, agreed.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

But you do get that the group you’re part of isn’t feminist, right? A lobby that is for males to gain access to either female spaces or third spaces does not logically translate to a feminist act.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (9 children)

No, I guess I don't get that. I'll let them know though, but coming from me it probably won't mean much to them.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

You don’t see what’s not feminist about a male like yourself asking women to help you and other males avoid the men’s room or access the women’s room? Really?

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Today everything is called feminism.

There people even calling gender ideology as feminism: https://saidit.net/s/LGBDropTheT/comments/7c2j/battling_an_internal_masculinity_struggle_right/rqfy?context=1

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

A user here who I won’t name once told me feminism can be for whales or about veganism. There’s just no meaning to words anymore. Everything is just what people want it to mean.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I saw vegan radical feminists few times, but they were nuked from Ovarit, and most radfems are saying that it is women-hating movement. Their ideas are so strange - female cattle is abused too, and so feminists must help animals, even by sacrificing themselves and their rights, because, as they said, if you stop abusing cattle - every abuse system will be stopped, as they are all working same way and connected, so protecting animals will solve sexism and racism. They are equating women and people of color with cattle and saying it is fine as cattle should be respected and saved. It is such a bizzare idea, I am not surprised they were nuked from Ovarit.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

That's not what our group is discussing at all, I'm really not sure where you're getting that. Just because it's our shared belief doesn't mean that's what we're discussing. You seem fixated on this idea that that's what this group is discussing and that I'm asking these women to let me into their spaces. They already hold the belief that it's fine, so that has nothing to do with our discussion. We're focused on stopping predators from accessing our respective spaces.

[–]HouseplantWomen who disagree with QT are a different sex 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The best way to keep out dangerous males is to keep out all males.

It does seem like it’s the focus of the group since it’s the only thing you’ve said it’s for. I understand now it’s just women who already think men can be honorary women.

It didn’t seem like you primarily advocated for seperate private spaces from each other. My bad.

The issue with single stalls or floor to ceiling stalls is that it’s more difficult and/or time consuming for cleaners. You’ve suddenly got three times as much corner to mop, and less room to manoeuvre a broom or mop. A seperate room for transwomen would be fine but it’s up to males to get it. Feminism has nothing to do with it. Since transmen don’t like the women’s room and are also unsafe around men they would also need a space so two new bathrooms are needed.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

You make a good point with there being extra work for cleaners. But maybe a solution is to phase out the current model of shared public bathrooms and start creating more single unisex stalls. I think a LOT of people could get behind that. Honestly, who enjoys using public bathrooms, especially when you can't get privacy? Not fun. It's something I'm sure we'll touch more on in our group discussions, I'll definitely bring it up :)

[–]ZveroboyAlinaIs clownfish a clown or a fish? 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

They already hold the belief that it's fine

She means this, not your position or needs.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I didn't ask them that. I didn't ask them to believe anything. Perhaps it seems impossible or unlikely for a GC radfem to have this belief without any prompting or begging from a trans person, but that's the case here. Maybe some other trans person asked them to before they joined, but it certainly wasn't me or anyone else in our group.