People who think being gay is wrong and/or disgusting, why?

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[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

And in contradiction to the leftist narrative homosexuality is not normal or natural.

How is it not natural? Are these people supernatural?

We understand very well why sexuality exists, and some contrived argument about animals being gay does not challenge that understanding.

It's not that contrived though. It shows that it is natural.

Sociological studies proved conclusively that the nuclear family is extremely important to a strong country, good mental health, high IQs, productivity, lifetime achievement.

This is wrong. There's a strong consensus in sociological research that gay parents are not disadvantaging in mental heath, IQ, productivity or lifetime achievement.

Destroying the nuclear family on a large scale is not without consequences.

Yeah it is.

Studies have shown that sexual fetishes (homosexuality is a type of fetish) can increase when you indulge in them.

Homosexuality is not a type of fetishism.

Symptoms of Fetishistic Disorder According to the DSM-5, there are three criterion for Fetishistic Disorder, and four specifiers that can be applied:

A. Over a six month period, the individual has experienced sexual urges focused on a non-genital body part, or inanimate object, or other stimulus, and has acted out urges, fantasies, or behaviors.

B. The fantasies, urges, or behaviors cause distress, or impairment in functioning.

C. The Fetishistic object is not an article of clothing employed in cross dressing, or a sexual stimulation device, such as a vibrator.

[–]JimBob83 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

They aren't supernatural they're just mistakes of nature, like autism or downs, cancer or arthritis. Our greatest biological imperative is to produce offspring and these individuals are born with a disability that makes breeding much more unlikely.

[–]jet199 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

That assumes that humans can only pass on their genes by reproducing themselves.

The truth is humans are group animals and if you support your family and the children in it that's as good as having kids yourself.

[–]mahavishnunj 2 insightful - 4 fun2 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

They aren't supernatural they're just mistakes of nature, like autism or downs

i think we have an expert here who is suffering from the affliction and speaks from personal experience.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Is arthritis not natural?

Our greatest biological imperative is to produce offspring

Human society and culture has a few more dimensions than that.

Many people are creative without being procreative. And the fact that later siblings are more likely to be gay implies that there's a biological advantage to it, given a natural environment.

[–]Canbot 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (9 children)

How is it not natural?

You already know how, but have been brainwashed to deny it and that is why you ask. That is why you ask the disingenuous question "is it supernatural". At that point you are no longer interested in an honest discussion, or learning.

But for the record, for others reading this, sexuality exists for the purpose of procreation. It is supposed to make you attracted to the opposite sex and get you to have sex despite any danger or harm you will suffer for doing that. The claim that "if nature does it then it is natural" is a pseudo intellectual argument. It purposefully takes the argument that homosexuality is not natural in a dishonestly literal sense turning it into a strawman argument to return a stupid answer. Literally anything that is unnatural can be twisted this way to say "it is natural because humans are part of nature therefore everything humans do is natural". This is not cleaver, or intelligent, or useful. It does not address or dispel the issue. It is bullshit.

Mental illness is a real thing. It is a complex thing. It is not well understood. But when you have some wires crossed and believe one of your limbs doesn't belong to you, that is not natural. When you have some wires crossed and your sexual desires are triggered by the wrong stimuli that is not natural.

It's not that contrived though. It shows that it is natural.

Once again, wrong. Natural in this context does not mean "existing in nature", that literally applies to everything. That twisting of logic is used to brainwash little kids who lack the brain development to understand that words have different meanings in different context and using the wrong meaning to make an argument is bullshit.

There's a strong consensus in sociological research

Again, we live in the new dark ages. Leftists have corrupted science, especially the soft sciences. There were two researchers who published a dozen fake papers in a peer review phsycology paper just by using leftist woke jargon. These papers were filled with absurdity and they were published. Meanwhile anything that challenges the narrative is rejected. Any scientists who challenge the narrative are attacked, censored, and blacklisted. Two very public examples of this are Jordan Peterson and Eric Weinstien.

There is a reason the reproducibility crisis exists, and with the state that modern science is in there that is not going to get rectified any time soon. It will get buried. You need to learn to think for yourself. "scientists agree" is no longer a credible statement, especially in the soft sciences. Leftist gatekeepers keep real science and honest scientists out.

Yeah it is.

Before social science was corrupted there were hundreds of years of research from around the world that proved you wrong. If you deny facts because you don't like the implications it has for your beloved world view, besides being incredibly stupid, it disadvantages you. You need to live in the world that exists, with all the things you don't like, rather than live in a bubble of delusions.

there are three criterion for Fetishistic Disorder,

Learn to read. Your evidence does not support your claim. There are lots of fetishes that do not meet these criteria, that does NOT mean they are not fetishes.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

You already know how, but have been brainwashed to deny it and that is why you ask.

No, I'm struggling to understand how.

That is why you ask the disingenuous question "is it supernatural".

No, I'm emphasising that it arises naturally, and so is natural.

But for the record, for others reading this, sexuality exists for the purpose of procreation.

If you're going to exclude gay from the meaning of "sexuality" in a thread about gay sexuality, your going to find your definitions too narrow to participate meaningfully.

The claim that "if nature does it then it is natural" is a pseudo intellectual argument.

Calling it names doesn't refute it. That's what natural means to me. What definition of natural are you using?

It purposefully takes the argument that homosexuality is not natural in a dishonestly literal sense turning it into a strawman argument to return a stupid answer.

Okay. What is the argument that "homosexuality is not natural"?

Mental illness is a real thing.

True, but irrelevant.

But when you have some wires crossed and believe one of your limbs doesn't belong to you, that is not natural.

Body integrity dysphoria is associated with a brain damage to the right parietal lobe. There are other physical symptoms too. Skin conductance response is significantly different above and below the line of desired amputation. So it's not obvious that this is a mental problem and not a symptom of a physical problem.

But in any case, it's not related to homosexuality.

When you have some wires crossed and your sexual desires are triggered by the wrong stimuli that is not natural.

You're defining "not natural" as having a paraphilia?

Before social science was corrupted there were hundreds of years of research from around the world that proved you wrong.

Can you link me to some of this research?

There are lots of fetishes that do not meet these criteria, that does NOT mean they are not fetishes.

That's exactly what it means.

[–]Canbot 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

You desperately want to label homosexuality as natural because you don't have legitimate arguments so you play these grouping games. If you can put it in a box labeled natural you believe it automatically gives it other properties associated with that box, such as "good" and "normal". And your argument for calling it natural is nothing more than "it's natural because my definition of natural includes it." That is absurd, but I don't expect you to acknowledge that.

However, I am curious what you would say to a pedophile who said pedophilia is natural?

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Nope. I'm wondering how you can label it unnatural, because it's obviously natural.

I wasn't implying value judgements like "good" any more than any other sexual orientation is "good".

It's certainly normal.

I've not had a conversation with a pedophile who said pedophilia is natural. I'm not sure how it would go.

[–]Canbot 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I'm not sure how it would go.

Bro, it's literally YOUR response. Not a conversation, just your response. That's probably something you should think about because the bullshit you are using to defend your indefensible position can be used by others to defend theirs. Not just pedophiles. What do you say to murderers who say murder is natural? What do you say to cannibals? All of that exists in nature. If that is all it takes to claim something is "normal" then we are in a lot of trouble.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Behaviour is unethical when it hurts others.

Murder and pedophilia are evil not because they're unnatural. They're evil because they hurt someone.

There's no continuum between that and homosexuality, or heterosexuality if they're acted on with consent.

[–]Canbot 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

I don't need to label it anything because none of my arguments rely on it being either way. But in the exact same way that a broken arm isn't natural (even though it exists in nature) neither is homosexuality. There is no biological function for it, it exists because a system with a function is broken and exhibits in this way. That is what I call abnormal, dysfunctional, and unnatural. For me it is a descriptor. The problem is that for you it is a category. A grouping. Because the way leftists think is group think. You believe that if you can label something then you have "proven" that the thing you labeled has all the properties of the group you put it in. I realize that is a human nature kind of thing, but humans who overcome that kind of backwards thinking move their politics to the right where things make more sense.

[–]mahavishnunj 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

watching you get owned beyond belief, and still digging yourself into your moron hole was a thing of beauty in this thread.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

And yet you label it unnatural.

There is no biological function for it, it exists because a system with a function is broken and exhibits in this way.

How do you know that they aren't selected for because they are able to provide support to the community and their families, by having more resources available due to not supporting a family themselves?

[–]mahavishnunj 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

you are now on my favorites list. stupidity of this level, when it seems REAL like this does...shit like this cant be bought. please keep delivering, lol.