Protester falls off a bank he was climbing and bleeds black all over the sidewalk.

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[–]InvoluntaryHalibut 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (18 children)

Oh I have so many ideas! If only they would make me supreme leader of the universe.

But maybe specifically with respect to climate change?

Full disclosure I feel CO2 driven AGW is a huge nothing burger built on some pretty skinny science and a manipulation of climate data. We are at a CO2 minimum in the geologic/atmospheric history of earth, even with respect to fairly recent history. CO2 has a logarithmic relationship to heat forcing which means it totally craps out as a covariate of global temperature after ~1000ppm, which is historically a normal level for CO2. But I imagine you disagree with all that.

Im all for energy efficiency and not polluting the environment. So why not build more nuclear power plants? It is an incredibly clean and efficient source of energy. The newer technologies make nuclear plants much easier to maintain. It is the most obvious solution for reducing use of carbon fossil fuels. Everyone could be using more clean electricity— so why isnt any one talkin about it? Why are we not building nuclear power plants? Its because they are not interested in a solution. This is a power grab. Power to regulate means you own it. A few politicians and billionaires will own all oil, gas, and coal. All. They are salivating . Do you get it?

Heres another no brainer. Locally source your manufactured goods. We used to make stuff in this country. Then Wall street used all our 401 K money to fund the chinese manufacturing sector. We now get all our manufactured goods shipped from China. How much fuel does that waste? If we manufactured goods here, we could reduce transportation fuel use, manage manufacturing pollution standards better (the chinese do not have ecofriendly practices) and improve quality of manufactured goods.

We used to manufacture appliances in this country that lasted decades. Now all our appliances break down in a fraction of the time and end up in a landfill. Improving quality of manufactured goods reduces waste dramatically. We now have a chinese monopoly on all manufactured products and they are all uniformly low quality and shipped inefficiently over long distances. Why does XR not talk about these common sense strategies. Because its a scam. A scam by a few oligarchs for political leverage. They dont care about the environment. They know it is easy to con 20 year old that have never taken a physics course in their life.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (17 children)

Full disclosure I feel CO2 driven AGW.... But I imagine you disagree with all that.

I have no opinion on it, as I am not familiar with it.

So why not build more nuclear power plants?

Uranium - no. But there are Thorium-based nuclear power projects underway.

Nonetheless - they're not needed. There are reliable green energy sources.

Locally source your manufactured goods.

XR protestors likely agree with this, as it also reduces the need to transport products long distances

Now all our appliances break down in a fraction of the time and end up in a landfill. Improving quality of manufactured goods reduces waste dramatically.

XR protestors likely agree with this

Why does XR not talk about these common sense strategies.

They're focused on corporate abuses that have cause the problems you also want resolved here. Corporate abuses can be regulated with a democratically elected government, and with the help of XR to pressure that goverment into acting for the 99%.

My question about solutions is not about some of the issues above, but about political and social challenges against the 'establishment".

[–]InvoluntaryHalibut 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

You have no opinion on anthropogenic global warming theory? Oh you’re the one. ;-) Im talking about the narrative that were all going to be living beyond thunderdome in 12 years if we dont ban cars and cows. That whole thing.

I see no reason to stop building uranium plants until its clear thorium plants are better. I just checked— we have 94 nuke plants running in the US and 20 of those will be shut down in the next 20 years. We are building 2. Why? We are losing nuclear power capabilty.

Why do you think they arent needed? If you want to reduce reliance on carbon fuels this is the proven technology. It has the highest efficiency after carbon fuels.

Green energy tech is reliably inefficient. Look at what happened in Texas last month during that snow storm. The state lost power because none of the wind and solar sources worked. Dozens froze to death. Those techs would work better if the battery technology improved but it hasn’t. You cant store that power for days, the energy supply is not steady. They need to be backed up 100% with another technology. When you factor in the costs to build massive wind turbines and solar farms (and take them down) and the additional infrastructure to accomodate them, they aren’t worth it.

Think about it. If these were super efficient energy sources you would not need a government mandate and a big government funded project to subsidize these new systems. Wall street would invest in them all by themselves because they’d see an opportunity to make money.

They need the sweet sweet govt $$$ to make their projects turn a profit because its an expensive way to make energy. The profit margins are too small. Most green energy is a gimmick to get government cash. Wall street fund managers with green energy heavy portfolios are funding extinction rebellion. Bet on it. They stand to make billions and whats a million dollars here or there to bribe professional rioter. Thats what I would do if I was a wall street sccum bag.

No one in XR is talking about nuclear or manufacturing protectionism. The profession protestors decide on the talking points (or their donors do) and the idiot students take their orders and lie in the streets. Their comprehension of the economic realities is simplistic which is why they make such good little soldiers. IMO XR does the bidding of billionaire elites and spits on the peasants trying to get to their shit jobs. Because someone else pays those kids’ bills. They are politically and economically naive.

I thought we already agreed our “democratically elected” goverment is a sham. Oligarchs cast Trump as literally Satan and Joe Biden as a “savior” for the little guy—what a joke. Is this who is going to honestly regulate the banks or the energy sector? The guy that installed his crack head son on the board of a foreign oil company?

Accept that the government bureacracy is as corrupt as the corporate one and they are not really separate. The government is not going to save you from the big bad bankers. They are the big bad bankers.

Starve the bureacracy. Lets start with that. End income tax. Or set it at >$million/year earners. These are mostly in reality fake jobs that do not create wealth. Replace them with manufacturing jobs.

Raise the price of labor by controlling the supply. The law of supply and demand works here, just like with any product. Billionaires want the supply of labor to be large so that it is cheap. Instead of attacking the problem of low wages from a common sense economic pov, communists retardedly advocate increase in labor supply while pushing the gimmicky $15 national minimum wage policy, which does nothing to fix the problem.

Understand that when billionaires control the price of a dollar, raising minimum wage is meaningless. That is because a dollar has no intrinsic value. As long as we are on a fiat currency controlled by billionaires we are fucked.

Heres another point— end inflation. Inflation is a choice. It is a scam to force people to invest in the wall street shit show. Back the dollar with commodities and aim for zero inflation. This basically takes all the power from the fed. Which is a good thing.

Hope I didnt try your patience too much but I think you asked for it. I could go on but I will have mercy on you

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

I could go on but I will have mercy on you

All of this seems to be part of a computer game commentary.

anthropogenic global warming theory

If you refer to man-made global climate change, yes, that's the main concern for XR &c

I thought we already agreed our “democratically elected” goverment is a sham.

No, that's not the issue here

The issue is: what's your solution to political change?

[–]InvoluntaryHalibut 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

All of this seems to be part of a computer game commentary.

Well I dont think so but aside from the style critique, did you understand it? Was it comprehensible to you?

Naturally, I cant download my entire political and economic philosophy in one comment but you asked me for alternatives and since we were on the subject of extinction rebellion I gave you several specific suggestions regarding clean energy. And then you said you wanted more political and social examples and again I gave you some.

You think some extinction rebellion guy climbing up the side of chase bank is a “social and political solution”, but when I say specifically how to raise real wages or diminish Wall Street’s power by defanging the Fed, its not a solution. When I suggest depriving the corrupt bureacracy of its 4 billion dollar yearly welfare check, you say its not a solution. What is your idea of a social /political solution then? Is it possible that you dont see economic solutions as political and social solutions because you think these things are separate? Economics is human behavior. Its really not about money.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

to raise real wages or diminish Wall Street’s power by defanging the Fed

Yes - it's a great idea.

But it's only one basic idea. Many steps are necessary, one of which is XR. Your idea doesn't negate their physical activism, not by a long shot. You'll also want to know how your ideas will work in the broader context of US and Geo-politics, not to mention the assistance that would be necessary from other forms of activisism and ways of voting for the appropriate candidates.

What is your idea of a social /political solution then?

To work within the current system to improve upon it

[–]InvoluntaryHalibut 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

Yes - it's a great idea.

But do you understand how to accomplish that? Its by controlling the supply of labor. Not by slapping a bandaid on with a fake national minimum wage law which addresses little green pieces of paper with no inherent value. Not by climbing on to buildings.

There are only two ways to increase wages

  1. Increase demand of labor — more manufacturing for example

  2. Decrease labor supply - for example, stop importing labor to undercut domestic workers.

Those are the only ways to increase the price of labor. The ONLY WAYS. Raising fake dollar wages only inflates the dollar. This is one of their tricks, make you feel like you have more wealth when the dollar only loses value. You cant just pass a law “Pay poor people more $$$, meanies” because passing laws doesnt creat any additional wealth. It just makes a dollar worth a little less. More little green papers, same amount of wealth.

Now that you know how to raise the real price of labor, tell me why XR is against both these things?

I realize that is one basic idea but I wanted you do understand there is an economic mechanism at work. Affect that and you can produce real social change.

Tell me why XR is a necessary step for positive social change. What is their physical activism accomplishing? Dont say raise awareness. That is meaningless. Thats just code for indocrinate more people. How are any of their demands going to fix a broken political and economic system, in practical terms.

You say ‘activism’ like its an end unto itself. How does it improve anything. How do you know ‘activism’ isnt making things worse? Since it seems to have no concrete suggestions that are constructive. This is like a christian saying “we need to pray more”, why?

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

Increase demand of labor — more manufacturing for example Decrease labor supply - for example, stop importing labor to undercut domestic workers.

You keep repeating your points, but without noting how this would happen. It's as if you want to repeat 'black pill' talking points, without discussing the method of the solution. I've mentioned the method. Unlike you, I am not oversimplifying anything by concentrating on one idea or another. The essential argument is that you have to be open to several options that may be useful.

[–]InvoluntaryHalibut 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Im sorry for being repetitive. I feel that when you understand how these systems work , its just like a physics problem, the solution becomes obvious.

Billionaires are importing labor, skilled and unskilled. We dont need either. We have a ton of both skilled and unskilled workers that need higher paying jobs.

Its colonization pure and simple. Todays aristocrats are doing it for the exact same reason they did it in the colonial era. Moving Scottish protestants in to ireland. Moving Indians into Burma, moving Chinese people in to malasia and africans to America. Cheap labor and political leverage.

There are other ways to limit the labor supply. End no fault divorce, tax only dual income households and singles earners over 30. The truth is when women moved into the work force it cut wages in half and caused families to work twice as hard. Now we have a lot of people working in a worthless bureacracy and not enough people birthing and raising children. In fact no one is raising children except for the internet and public school teachers, who are not doing a great job at it.

Increasing domestic manufacturing will also drive up labor costs.

Black pill is more like a person who is really toxic and negative, someone who has given up looking for constructive solutions and just keeps repeating doomed sentiments and demoralizing everyone.

I have given you some ideas and some specifics about those ideas. Why dont you tell me what XRs strategy is for fixing society other than talking about how bad white people are? What options are you talking about? Maybe you dont want to say on here because you dont want to end up on a list. Fine. Just say so. But it seems like you ask me for specifics and I gave you a few and then you said I was too specific. And youve failed to give me any inkling of why I should support XR because you havent articulated what solutions they advocate that you like.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

the solution becomes obvious.

Thus we can write them down.

Billionaires are importing labor, skilled and unskilled.

Exactly - thus reduce the number of H1-B visas that can be offered. This would rely on government support. Pressure on the government to do this would have to come from the 99%.

End no fault divorce,

This is a human rights violation; a non-starter

tax only dual income households and singles earners over 30.

I am not sure this is necessary, as the tax would be based on income.

The truth is when women moved into the work force it cut wages in half and caused families to work twice as hard.

This is not true, and at best a gross oversimplification. Multiple factors kept wages stagnant, driven principly by the 1% and Big Corp.

Now we have a lot of people working in a worthless bureacracy and not enough people birthing and raising children.

This is another oversimplification and does not support your approach to limiting the available labor. Fertility rates are mush lower, but the world is overpopulated. Reducing the population is good.

In fact no one is raising children except for the internet and public school teachers, who are not doing a great job at it.

No evidence for this, even if it were remotely true.

Increasing domestic manufacturing will also drive up labor costs.

Yes; a win-win

I have given you some ideas and some specifics about those ideas.

All of the solutions you mention would require government intervention, which requires political activitism, voting, &c. This political aspect of the solution is what I've been asking for. The 1% (and Republicans) will not help you. The party and politician that supports the 99% will help.

Why dont you tell me what XRs strategy is for fixing society other than talking about how bad white people are?

It's just a group that brings much needed attention to the problems of Climate Change (because it's man-made), in order to help the public and government appreciate that something must be done. They have impressive strategies for getting in the news and calling attention to themselves and the cause. It's not complicated. The more people are aware of the problems of man-made Climate Change and ways to deal with it, they more they will make political decisions that will help deal with these problems. XR thereby helps the 99%, as they protest against the 1%.

Maybe you dont want to say on here because you dont want to end up on a list. Fine. Just say so.

This is strange. I've explained XR several times in the thread.