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Yesterday I had the honor of speaking at The Rally to End Child Mutilation. The rally was scheduled in response to the Vanderbilt Medical Center, where unearthed videos of a presentation made by Dr Shayne Taylor encouraged Vanderbilt to begin child mutilations because they are a “big money maker.”
submitted 1 year ago by Chipit from realityslaststand.com
[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 4 fun7 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 4 fun - 1 year ago (20 children)
What Is a Man?
Matt Walsh Should Be an Intactivist
Circumcision is the oldest and most common form of child genital mutilation. Please oppose all unnecessary and non-consensual/coercive genital alterations being performed on minors.
[–]Chipit[S] 9 insightful - 3 fun9 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 3 fun - 1 year ago (19 children)
Oh look, it's whataboutism attempting to distract from the issue at hand. How unusual.
[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 3 fun - 1 year ago (10 children)
Matt Walsh opposes one form of child genital mutilation, but supports another. I was pointing out his hypocrisy.
When someone holds a rally to promote a particular view of theirs, I think it's fair to question why that person also espouses a contradictory view on a similar subject.
I don't want children to be transed or circumcised.
[–]Alienhunter糞大名 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (9 children)
Purity spirals start this way. Comparing infant male circumcision with childhood gender transitions is so retarded because the effects of the later so far exceed the effects of the former we aren't even in the same solar system when it comes to the magnitude of the future consequences.
People can rightly hold logical viewpoints on things while also holding other seemingly contradictory opinions, is it hypocritical. Perhaps. But in their own mind that isn't necessarily the case. We shouldn't allow the kind of all encompassing ideological basis to dictate a kind of orthodoxy in activist circles, issue atomicity is important if anything is to be achieved. The arguments towards ideological hypocrisy and contradictory viewpoints towards other issues needs to remain in the realm of philosophy.
Infant male circumcision is at it's root something that is completely dictated by cultural and religious norms. Anyone whom is from a culture that does not practice it will find it to be barbaric and strange. Anyone who is from a culture that does will find the practice to be normal to the point they don't question it. Walsh in this case being an American Catholic is of the latter persuasion most likely. And frankly won't see the parallels made as anything more than an attempt to sideline the argument. Indeed because the effects of infant male circumcision are so miniscule to be irrelevant in most cases barring the issues with botched circumcisions.
There's certainly an argument to be made against the practice, and I'm pretty firmly in the against camp here, but that's an argument for another place and time because it's frankly far less important an issue than just about everything else.
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (3 children)
It's a deliberately obtuse take in an attempt to take away from the point being made. It's a bad faith argument.
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (2 children)
I'm trying to strengthen Matt Walsh's argument, not take away from it.
His current views are inconsistent, and I'm not the only one who's noticed.
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (1 child)
The perfect is the enemy of the good. It's OK if we stand up against transing children.
You really, really come across strongly as having a bad faith argument.
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (0 children)
The perfect is the enemy of the good.
Fair enough.
It's OK if we stand up against transing children.
I'm opposed to transing children. I don't know why you're saying this.
I've been honest with you. I've also been patient with you, after you've insulted me multiple times.
If you want to believe that I'm arguing in bad faith, there's nothing I can do about it. Matt Walsh is the one being openly hypocritical, though, so I don't understand how you can accuse me of bad faith but not acknowledge his.
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (4 children)
I just want people to care about the millions of boys who have had their bodily autonomy/integrity violated by this nonsense.
Circumcision is not harmless. I don't believe the adverse effects have been properly studied. I have personally suffered a great deal of mental and physical anguish due to being circumcised. I don't appreciate you downplaying that aspect of it.
Transing children is worse, I agree, but circumcision is happening on a significantly larger scale. Regardless, it's not a competition. Both are harmful and unnecessary, and both can be challenged at the same time using the same arguments.
I made my original comment because this sort of moral inconsistency from people like Matt Walsh bothers me. If he had remained silent on the topic of circumcision, I would've assumed he opposed it. But now that I know he defends male genital mutilation, now that I know he probably mutilated his own sons' genitals, why on earth should I trust anything he has to say about other parents mutilating their children?
I'm not trying to "sideline the argument." I'm just disappointed.
[–]Alienhunter糞大名 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (3 children)
I have personally suffered a great deal of mental and physical anguish due to being circumcised. I don't appreciate you downplaying that aspect of it.
It's not about you.
I know. It's about:
the millions of boys who have had their bodily autonomy/integrity violated by this nonsense.
And the millions more who will be violated next year, and the year after that, and the year after that.
The damage to me is done. All I can do now is wait for opportunities to bring this issue to more people's attention.
The Rally to End Child Mutilation seemed like one of those opportunities. But maybe it's more about being anti-trans than pro-child? It's difficult not to think so when:
Matt Walsh opposes one form of child genital mutilation, but supports another.
[–]Alienhunter糞大名 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (1 child)
The "rally to end child mutilation" is about transing kids. You can attempt to derail that by bringing circumcision into it if you wish
Should you wish to hold a separate rally about circumcision, I'll support you. But issues must be treated in an atomicistic manner if we are to see success.
Shouldn't it be called The Rally to End the Transing of Kids, then?
I would have zero problems with that.
But as it stands, The Rally to End Child Mutilation sounds like it should include circumcision. At the very least, I don't think people should be mad if I reach that conclusion based on the name.
I'm not trying to derail anything. I first heard about this rally on the intactivism subreddit. I couldn't share my opinion there because it's inexplicably pro-trans, so I came over here.
I can agree with your point about focusing on one issue at a time, that's probably the most efficient way. But I think it's fair to criticize Matt Walsh for using vague language like "child mutilation," when he only opposes one specific form of it and not all child mutilation.
If we are to see success, shouldn't we avoid contradicting ourselves?
[–]IMissPorn 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (7 children)
Oh look, it's a whataboutismist attempting to distract from the fact that their stupid charity's name is a lie.
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (6 children)
Now we have several accounts doing this together? How do you all know to appear in the same threads? Social media dashboard?
Removing children's genitals is an issue that shouldn't be controversial. But hey, bringing up irrelevant points in an attempt to derail the conversation is the exact sort of thing paid posters do. Weird, eh?
[–]IMissPorn 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (4 children)
It's not irrelevant. The topic title says child mutilation, and that's what we're talking about. Why is that weird to you? Even under the narrower category of removing children's genitals, removing parts of them is still very relevant.
I still think it's hilarious that anyone believes people get paid to post on an insignificant website like this, but hey, if somebody does want to pay me to astroturf against child mutilation of all kinds, PM me, we can work something out.
For someone who's not a paid poster, you sure are acting exactly like one. This is an anti-censorship Reddit clone. What kind of people who support trannies get banned from Reddit?
[–]IMissPorn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun - 1 year ago* (2 children)
For someone who's not a paid poster, you sure are acting exactly like one.
Well I guess it would look like that when you just assume everyone else is getting paid. Still no takers on my anti-mutilation astroturfing offer, BTW.
This is an anti-censorship Reddit clone.
Not really. Doesn't even allow porn. Anti-certain-kinds-of-censorship maybe.
What kind of people who support trannies get banned from Reddit?
Not sure. Maybe people who point out how anti-LGBT Islam and China are, or something like that. What does that have to do with the matter at hand though?
[–]Chipit[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun - 1 year ago (1 child)
What, you can't find porn on the internet? Why on earth do we need it here?
[–]IMissPorn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun - 1 year ago (0 children)
Just stating facts.
Two isn't "several."
I can't speak for u/IMissPorn, but I've been lurking on Saidit for a while.
I don't have much to say most of the time, but occasionally an opportunity to talk about something important to me will arise, so I create a throwaway account.
I usually end up getting bored or annoyed after a few days, then I delete my account and go back to lurking.
I wish I was getting paid for this. That would mean someone with money and influence actually cared about fighting male genital mutilation. Unfortunately, I'm just me.
[–]hfxB0oyADon't piss on my head & tell me it's raining. 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun - 1 year ago (0 children)
And the establishment wonders why people are starting to question medical advice these days...
[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 4 fun7 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 4 fun - (20 children)
[–]Chipit[S] 9 insightful - 3 fun9 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 2 fun10 insightful - 3 fun - (19 children)
[–][deleted] 7 insightful - 3 fun7 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 3 fun - (10 children)
[–]Alienhunter糞大名 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun - (9 children)
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - (3 children)
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - (2 children)
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - (1 child)
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - (0 children)
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - (4 children)
[–]Alienhunter糞大名 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun - (3 children)
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - (2 children)
[–]Alienhunter糞大名 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - (1 child)
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - (0 children)
[–]IMissPorn 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - (7 children)
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - (6 children)
[–]IMissPorn 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun - (4 children)
[–]Chipit[S] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun - (3 children)
[–]IMissPorn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun - (2 children)
[–]Chipit[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun - (1 child)
[–]IMissPorn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun - (0 children)
[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun - (0 children)
[–]hfxB0oyADon't piss on my head & tell me it's raining. 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun - (0 children)