The same people who say we need to "stop with the anti-semitism" are the same ones who will support anti-White rhetoric as free speech

submitted by EuropeanAwakening from self.SaidIt

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[–]Rationalmind 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

This is a flawed argument, it’s not an either/or. We can advocate for both stopping the anti-semitism AND the anti-white rhetoric. The type of dialogue you want to engage is the opposite side of the same coin. Right extremism looks at the top of the wealth distribution hierarchy and obsesses in jealously, left extremism looks to the bottom of the hierarchy and patronizingly victimizes out of warped sympathy. This type of worldview is extremely unproductive on their respective sides.

Also prevalent on both sides is the confirmation bias and the cognitive dissonance. Personally, I loathe hypocrisy and don’t dismiss my side when it applies a double standard. Don’t cast blame and don’t throw stones at glass houses. Self-reflect first and foremost. Take personal responsibility when you screw up, and own it and learn from it.

Constantly blaming someone else or some greater power outside your control is called an external locus of control. Research has shown that people who have an external locus of control are not as successful as people who believe they can shape their own destiny through their own actions. People who believe they can create their own destinies have an internal locus of control.

Basically I’m advocating for levelheaded and rational dialogue. I think this would benefit us and allow us to solve problems rather than casting blame onto someone else. Casting blame does nothing for us personally, it only makes us resentful and bitter. Someone else will not fix your problems, so when you whine and complain about it, you’re only hurting yourself.

Hopefully someone reads this and agrees that we should move towards a positive and productive dialogue.

[–]takeyourjoyjohn 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I've read your reply here and I agree with you. You've also taught me about external locus of control and I'm wanting to look more into that.

In your opinion, do you think these back and forth arguments on platforms such as these (where there's no downvoting) helps or hurts your perspective? Do you think common ground can ever come from it?

[–]Rationalmind 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Yay, I'm glad.

I do not think I can convince anyone that is obsessed with and believes in, an alt-right extremist identitarian ideology. Unbrainwashing someone requires you to have credibility with the person so they actually listen and care about what you have to say. These right extremists, like left extremists, are too absorbed in their own fanaticism to hear reason. It'd be like trying to undo indoctrination into a cult.

I wish there was downvoting button at the very least. The downvotes would at least hide and re-sort the identity politics conspiracies. Right now, the right extremists and their identitarian ideology is clogging up this website. I had to leave Reddit because of the left extremist identitarian ideology.

Did I answer your question?

[–]takeyourjoyjohn 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Yes you gave me a unique perspective into what you think would solve alot of issues across, not only saidit, but social media generally.

I think, personally, I'm scared of a down vote button. But my reasoning is because I fear being ignored or dismissed by having, even what many would consider, an innocent unpopular opinion. It's happened to me before on reddit and it sent me spiraling into a sort of existential, lonely depression. I know I shouldn't be that impressionable. So I'm wondering if the fear of a down vote button is something that needs to be overcome, or if there is a middle ground that needs to be discovered.

[–]Rationalmind 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

You raise a good point about the downvote button being used on opinions that are different. I think a lot of people on Reddit misused/abused the downvote button. I noticed that many on Reddit would use the downvote button to disagree and often never bothered to engage with the opinion they disagreed with. I think part of the reason for that behavior is because Reddit is highly moderated, and that results in a certain passiveness/ laziness from the user because they would just downvote and then wait for their parent to come clean up the mess.

I like your idea about a happy medium. Perhaps if saidit tailored some s/all subs to narrow the content for posting and discussion, then we wouldn’t need a downvote button. For example, the politics page could be focused around posting new political articles and then discussing them (or something). Then those more extreme views when off-topic could be confined to their respective fringe subs. Maybe if saidit did this, it would lead to higher quality content and discussion for pages that appear on s/all.

Perhaps Reddit’s problem is that it has both heavy moderation and a downvote button which has led to a passive user base. Just a thought.

[–]takeyourjoyjohn 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Reddit's problem was also the lazy propaganda and manipulation. I find it quite comforting to see the shills scramble for control and then it backfiring in their face.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

A huge motivation for the twofold problem on Reddit has been TOS creep and powermods. One way to halt that kind of thing on Saidit might be to limit one person to one page or topic for modding or ownership/admin.