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Political Lesbianism is not forced lesbianism/fake lesbianism.

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[–]Innisfree 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (41 children)

And having a problem with fake lesbians doesn't make any woman here a common bitch.

Strictly was obviously being tongue in cheek but it's clear that her intention was to make sure that we make the distinction between the history of the term and its current meaning. Nowhere does she condemn people who dislike modern political lesbians.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

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    [–]reluctant_commenter 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (33 children)

    Strictly was obviously being tongue in cheek

    I mean, I don't know. "Bitch" is a degrading slur and was used against me as such since I was a child, I don't think that's "tongue in cheek" for everybody. I feel about it the same was as I do about "queer". If someone wants to call themselves "bitch/queer", ok, but you can't assume other people will not interpret that as a slur.

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          [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

          There are over 100 comments on this thread so clearly they care. Lololol.

          [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 4 fun4 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

          All I have to say is it made for some good reading. I could picture the steam pouring out of some people’s ears while their reply was being typed out.

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                    [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

                    Really? You're going to throw away a nuanced and interesting thread that has provided historical context to controversial ideas, all because she used a word that you don't like? Even after she explained her reference?

                    [–][deleted]  (5 children)

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                      [–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

                      But unless I'm misunderstanding you, one of those comments was the original post, so I believe the entire thread would wind up being removed.

                      [–][deleted]  (3 children)

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                        [–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

                        You can disagree with a post while still engaging with its ideas as presented, and you can disagree with a post while misrepresenting their argument and digging your heels into your own entrenched biases. Many posters are continuing to attack the thread as being a defense of "fake lesbians" even though the OP spent a lot of words explaining she was not advocating for faux lesbianism as we currently understand it. I don't blame her for getting frustrated.

                        I also think getting offended by "common bitches" on a lesbian forum, especially after the OP provided relevant context, is a bit soft. It strikes me more like you're upset that she has an opinion that you dislike and are now seeking to punish her for it, rather than using the report button for legitimate abuse. if someone posted something you strongly agreed with and used the word "bitch", would you be reporting it?

                        [–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

                        It strikes me more like you're upset that she has an opinion that you dislike and are now seeking to punish her for it, rather than using the report button for legitimate abuse.

                        I don't think this is actually what is going on, though.. she was reported for the abusive language, not her opinion. This doesn't check out with reality.

                        Many posters are continuing to attack the thread as being a defense of "fake lesbians" even though the OP spent a lot of words explaining she was not advocating for faux lesbianism as we currently understand it.

                        I think her comments clarified this, but the title suggests the opposite, and I didn't see much in her post to indicate that she held this position-- although I know she is not for "fake lesbians" because I've read many of her other comments on different posts.

                        [–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

                        Oh, I didn't realize it was a reference. I live under a rock haha.

                        [–]Innisfree 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

                        Point taken. I welcome reminders that what I think normal may just be normal for my social bubble.

                        [–]reluctant_commenter 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

                        Thanks for considering it. :) I think a lot of people's differences in this thread just boil down to difference in perspective, rather than difference in actual opinion.

                        [–][deleted] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

                        Agreed - I don't want to speak for SD, but from how I understood her post, she's not saying anyone should agree with all of Jeffreys' ideas nor should they agree with modern LARPing straight women descendants, but they should look at political lesbianism in a historical context. Most of us would be secretaries getting groped by their bosses or saddled at home with 3 kids, not trailblazing a movement where women had the option to free themselves from men whether it be through celibacy or lesbianism. So spitting on the term and treating it as if it is beneath us instead of recognizing its origins is insulting to the women who allowed us to be who we are today.

                        [–]lairacunda 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

                        I think you are giving political lesbianism as a movement and as a force way too much credit. Yes, we'd all be screwed if Women's Lib had not happened. But most of the 2nd Wave women were not lesbians, political or bona fide. In fact one of the reasons the momentum died out was because so many women married themselves into patriarchal servitude.

                        [–]reluctant_commenter 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

                        I am inclined to agree. I would love to see actual numbers on it, but from how I have heard political lesbianism described, it seems like it was a minority group within second wave feminism.