DiscussionExtreme Homophobia on Ovarit (the norm)

submitted by stunaep from self.LGBDropTheT

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[–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Wrong link friend :) Here's the (ugly) permalink: https://ovarit.com/o/Radfemmery/83074/i-hope-we-all-acknowledge-this-here-3/7a3a880f-b2b5-4ad5-8483-15288861d688#comment-7a3a880f-b2b5-4ad5-8483-15288861d688

I agree with you about the subtle homophobia in this. It starts out phrased and couched in LGB terminology, but it's very much using RF talking points to be homophobic. This user doesn't care what LGB needs are, and is not our ally.

Gay people had no reason to work with RadFems because, among other things, we weren't fighting AGAINST marriage. We were fighting FOR THE ABILITY TO MARRY, what everyone else has the freedom and legal recognition to do.

the framing of surrogacy as a gay rights issue

Surrogacy is 100% a RadFem issue to abolish. No one else cares. If a woman wants to get pregnant, that is her choice. If a woman gets pregnant and wants to have that child for a couple who cannot conceive, her choice. If she gets paid for it, her choice. If she does it out of the goodness of her heart, or because she wanted the child and later realized that was wrong and adopts it out, or because she was subjected to terrible rapey circumstances and is being paid for her silence ... her choice. She has the womb, she makes the decision.

This is a prime example of why RadFems can be our sisters, but we are not the same, and why LGBDropTheT is not a RadFem/GC sub. We have some commonalities, but our needs and goals are different.

[–]SilverWolf 4 insightful - 5 fun4 insightful - 4 fun5 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

If a woman wants to get pregnant, that is her choice. If a woman gets pregnant and wants to have that child for a couple who cannot conceive, her choice. If she gets paid for it, her choice. If she does it out of the goodness of her heart, or because she wanted the child and later realized that was wrong and adopts it out, or because she was subjected to terrible rapey circumstances and is being paid for her silence ... her choice.

Ironically, these people seem to be very anti-choice. No choice to get married, no choice to be a surrogate. Wouldn't surprise me if they didn't want women to have the choice to get an abortion, seems like abortions would be required by them because "being a mother gives in to the patriarchy" or some bullshit like that

[–]reluctant_commenter 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Oh, I was just linking to the overall thread, but thank you! :)

I agree with you about the subtle homophobia in this.

I'm relieved to hear that lol. I worry a lot that in our eagerness to escape one group of oppressors, TRAs, we're running headlong into the arms of another. I know our sub is focused on a bigger threat than radical feminism currently poses to LGB people, but homophobia is homophobia, and it needs to be called out. And I agree with your assessment of radfems' different objectives regarding gay marriage and surrogacy.

I see a lot of LGB detransitioners dive into GC/radfem groups after they detransition... and it makes me really worried. Those detransitioners are people who have already been preyed upon by one cult-like ideology... I worry that they lack the self-esteem and boundary-setting capabilities, such that if they encounter radfem homophobia, they'll just accept it as normal and lose even more self-esteem. I say this, having almost been one of those people myself... that near-miss type of experience has put me on edge about any similar type of ideology. And radical feminism has some pretty significant similarities to transgender ideology. That's sort of where I'm coming from, if that makes sense.