I skimmed it because I'm really not into Ovarit but I'm glad the discussions take place there so that they don't take place here. Tbh I saw what appeared to be overwhelming support for distinguishing LGB from T in the comments on the second link. For the first link, holy moly to the proposed teachings. Yea that's the kind of stuff I've come to associate with Ovarit. I'm very much an "OK, but we need to live together in a society" type person. So while I can agree with a lot of the issue-spotting, I'm not into myopic, counterproductive "solutions," which are just as divisive as the policies coming out of queer theory and critical race theory. I do think the thrust of what's being said is misandry with the homophobia only being derivative of that. Like gay men are still men, and by virtue of that they have no virtue. Saying gay men are misogynistic for not being attracted to female bodies is just the flipside of what the TRAs say. As usual, heterosexuals don't understand homosexuality.