GC: Are there specific alternative treatments to SRS and HRT that have proven effective for successfully treating the most severe forms of gender dysphoria or transsexualism?

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[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (9 children)

I do watch a lot of YouTube vlogs from detransitioners and desisters, I really like watching them a lot actually. I haven't found anyone who has desisted or detransitioned who grew up with that extreme classic gender dysphoria/transsexualism though. Do you have any recommendations? Most seem to have developed gender dysphoria in adolescence as teenagers or older children, or even as adults. I've been looking for one I relate to more. They've definitely helped convince me that transition is not right for everyone and can really do serious harm sometimes.

If alternate forms of therapy should be a method of treatment, why wouldn't I want to listen to what therapists have to say on the matter? Just because someone online said that a medication didn't work for them doesn't mean it wouldn't work for another and the person should really be consulting their doctor rather than other peoples' anecdotes.

edit: I just clicked the link. I actually watched his videos a few days ago, they were quite interesting and he's very articulate. Unfortunately, he didn't experience "classic" early onset transsexualism and I can't really relate to his experience of gender dysphoria (or sex dysphoria, or lack thereof rather) and it clearly wasn't best for him to have transitioned. Thank you for sharing that link though!

[–]worried19 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I think girls and boys are very different when it comes to dysphoria.

Most detransitioners are female and had puberty-onset dysphoria. There don't seem to be quite as many detransitioned men around. This man transitioned at 19, but I don't know if he had genital dysphoria stemming from childhood. He doesn't appear to have gotten surgery.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-8195531/Man-transitioned-living-girl-says-woman-wrong-reasons.html

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Thank you for sharing this article! Even though he transitioned when he was a young adult in a time before the transgender boom, I found this line interesting: "Looking back now, I realize I never felt like a woman." He said he was a chubby gay boy who felt uncomfortable and thought being a woman would be easier.

I think the language that children, adolescents and adults use to describe their feelings of dysphoria are really informative and might help to narrow down and tailor treatment more to the individual, paying special attention to how the person perceives themselves. Like, like someone who grows up insisting they are the opposite sex is very different than someone who sees themself as becoming the opposite sex (or gender). Most children do grow out of those beliefs and most adolescents don't feel some kind of discomfort with their bodies or sex until puberty starts. We will probably see more and more people detransition as time goes on until enough people call attention to it and question how right medical transition is, unfortunately. Research probably won't be seriously conducted until then.

[–]worried19 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

He was never medically diagnosed either, which is the same thing that is happening now. We're already beginning to see a surge of desisters and detransitioners who self diagnosed and/or did not meet any clinical definition for transsexuality.

Unfortunately, activists seem hell bent on preventing research into these groups. Which is so fucked up. If activists really and truly cared about protecting gender nonconforming kids, they would want to prevent children from being sterilized or having their bodies and voices permanently altered if there was any chance, let alone a good chance, that such drastic measures would be unnecessary.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Interesting! But sad at the same time, hopefully he's living a better life now for having experienced that.

I think it's going to take the "in" status and legitimacy of transsex people to be a key factor in fighting against the advocacy. Maybe it's not totally necessary, and it's certainly not expected, but it would be nice if critics of the transgender activists would help us by at least recognizing and acknowledging the existence of actual trans people though. Many actual trans people would and do support most critics of the trans rights activism, but we feel that they are unapproachable because we are often included with the people who are called trans, but really aren't--or at least not transsex. I think the sooner we can learn to all team up and work together, the sooner this harmful trans rights monstrosity can go away.

[–]worried19 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think GC people should form alliances with GC-leaning and old-school transsexuals. We don't have to be enemies. This wave of animosity between radical feminists and the trans community is fairly new, and I think for the most part it's due to this recent wave of trans activism.

The main problem I see is that bridges have been burned. I'm active on Ovarit, and most women there are just entirely fed up. The social climate isn't like it was 10 or even 5 years ago. There's hostility not just towards the badly behaved activists, but towards trans people in general. I wish that weren't the case. I think it can reverse, but it's going to take a lot of work, and that just isn't going to happen when the public face of the trans movement consists of people like Chase Strangio and Grace Lavery.

the existence of actual trans people

To be fair, it is common for GC people to believe that there are no actual trans people, in the sense that because biological sex is fixed, you can't actually transition out of your birth sex. But I think most do differentiate between old-school transsexuals and fetishists/trenders. I do see some try to argue that HSTS transsexuals are just homophobic, appropriating gay men, but I think it's a minority view. I certainly don't feel that way. I believe transsexuals suffer from legitimate mental distress that in rare cases may be helped by hormones and surgeries. It doesn't make them women, but it also doesn't just make them effeminate gay men. They're their own category.

[–]MarkTwainiac 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Unfortunately, he didn't experience "classic" early onset transsexualism and I can't really relate to his experience of gender dysphoria (or sex dysphoria, or lack thereof rather) and it clearly wasn't best for him to have transitioned. Thank you for sharing that link though!

Maya Kaye is a MtF transsexual who had childhood sex distress, medically and surgically transitioned, and is now moving beyond... Maya has many thoughtful videos on Maya's YT channel. https://youtu.be/erFBKAFNzJ0

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I've watched a couple of Maya's videos before and enjoyed them, thank you! I'll have to watch more. But from what I have seen, a small but significant distinction I would like to point out is that even as a child with gender dysphoria, they didn't believe they were a girl or the opposite sex, but rather wanted to become one/transition at such a young age, which I find interesting--it varies from my experience of believing I was a girl who was going to grow up to be a woman, until I was about 10 and discovered that I wasn't. Maya's personality precludes that, and I've found that commonality among all detransitioners I've seen or read about. None of them actually from the very beginning believed they were already the opposite sex.

[–]MarkTwainiac 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

BTW, I read your account on the other thread where you explained your experience growing up. Sorry, it came off to me like retconning. I don't find it credible that until age 10 you didn't know the difference between males and females and thought you were female. We all tell ourselves stories about our childhoods to explain what happened later and how we ended up where we are in life. But as good therapists helps their clients see, there's often a big difference between the stories we tell ourselves about our childhoods and what really happened... Centra questions to ask is, why is it that we "remember" the events in our childhoods in a certain way? How does believing the narrative that's gotten fixed in our minds help us? And how does it hinder us?

BTW, if you have siblings, how does their account jibe with and differ from yours? What does/did your mother and father and other adults who were there say?

I'll explain more on the other thread.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I respect your skepticism. But yes, if you want me to elaborate on any of that, I'd be glad to for clarity's sake.