Joe Biden is personally responsible for yet another American woman's death

submitted by iamonlyoneman from (themidwesterner.news)

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[–]ActuallyNot 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (23 children)

Is he personally responsible for saving the lives of the 2,750 American men, woman and children who weren't killed as part of the recent decline in homicides?

Because 2,750 is a lot more people than 2.

Homicides in US dropped by more than 13% in 2023, FBI data shows

[–]WoodyWoodPeckerHah he he he hah! 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (10 children)

They shouldn't be shot in the first place. Homicides are down because of the price of bullets, costs too much to shoot a person now. You can just troll them on Twitter.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Saving 2,750 lives.

[–]WoodyWoodPeckerHah he he he hah! 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

That is the police's responsibility, not Biden's.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

1) Why is the price of bullets the police's responsibility?

2) Why is Biden personally responsible for the consequences of the actions of Customs and Border Protection, but not of the Police?

[–]WoodyWoodPeckerHah he he he hah! 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why do you not have a kosher buttplug?

[–]WoodyWoodPeckerHah he he he hah! 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

1) I didn't say that, quit putting words in my mouth. 2) Because the police are at the city and state level, Customs and Border Patrol are at the federal level.

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

1) You said the 2750 lives saved last year, which you attribute to the price of bullets, is the responsibility of the police.

Can you explain how that isn't saying that the price of bullets is the responsibility of police?

2) You appear to be claiming that homicide is never the responsibility of federal law enforcement, and always state or city level law enforcement. That's not true.

[–]WoodyWoodPeckerHah he he he hah! 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

1) I said the police are not controlled by Biden and neither are bullet prices. However, with Bidenomics everything is 2X 3X cost.

2) Biden does not control the police, but the federal agents. This does not mean that homicide is never the responsibility of federal law enforcement. Quit adding words!

[–]ActuallyNot 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

However, with Bidenomics everything is 2X 3X cost.

Which saved 2750 lives last year.

Biden does not control the police, but the federal agents.

Right. But we're taking about the 2750 people not murdered last year. So Biden is directly responsible for saving some of them?

This does not mean that homicide is never the responsibility of federal law enforcement. Quit adding words!

You claimed that the drop in homicides is not due to Biden because it is the responsibility of the police, because they're not federal.

So it very much looks like that was what you're saying. You're welcome to clarify your position. Saying "quit adding words" didn't do that.

[–]WoodyWoodPeckerHah he he he hah! 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You clearly didn't understand what I said. This debate can go no further if you are ignorant or playing games with me. If you are really centris you'd drop the black and white thinking and use shades of gray instead,

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Homicides in US dropped by more than 13% in 2023, FBI data shows

Did homicides actually decrease, or did cops just stop reporting them to the FBI?

When people talk about how black men are killed by police: "The FBI stats on shootings by cops are terrible, most police departments don't even report murders let alone killings by police."

When people talk about murders by (legal or illegal) immigrants: "Don't worry, FBI crime states show that the number of murders is going down."

The truth is that nobody in America wants accurate crime stats.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Did homicides actually decrease, or did cops just stop reporting them to the FBI?

13%? Almost certainly a drop in homicides. But the CDC will confirm.

Do you have some data that suggests a drop in reporting?

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The CDC tracks homicides the same way the FBI does: by asking the states to please send them a report on how many homicides they want to admit occurred. So it is vulnerable to exactly the same issues of non-reporting and misclassification.

Do you have some data that suggests a drop in reporting?

Specifically, no, but the FBI stats are not high quality and shouldn't be taken as gospel.

There are just under 18,000 independent law enforcement agencies across the USA. That's not 18,000 offices or branches, that's 18,000 independent agencies with their own chain of command, their own administration standards, their own computer systems, their own decision makers, and every single one of them can decide for themselves whether or not to submit crime stats to the FBI or CDC, and if so, how much effort they are willing to put in to ensure the stats are even half-way true.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

You're claiming that the recent drop on homicides may be due to a massive drop in reporting to the FBI.

Reporting to the CDC is independent of that, so it would add to the confidence in the data if it also shows the decrease.

Specifically, no, but the FBI stats are not high quality and shouldn't be taken as gospel.

The 13% decease is likely due to a drop in homicides of about that though.

There are just under 18,000 independent law enforcement agencies across the USA. That's not 18,000 offices or branches, that's 18,000 independent agencies with their own chain of command, their own administration standards, their own computer systems, their own decision makers, and every single one of them can decide for themselves whether or not to submit crime stats to the FBI or CDC, and if so, how much effort they are willing to put in to ensure the stats are even half-way true.

Which would be approximately the same one year to the next. And there's nothing to suggest that of our did change there would be a bias towards less reporting of homicides in 2023.

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Reporting to the CDC is independent of that

You have a funny understanding of what "independent" means.

The data is coming from the same source, so it's not independent. If a certain department becomes extra vigilant and conscientious at reporting crime, that will be reflected in the figures they submit to both the FBI and the CDC. (Chances are they'll submit the exact same figures to both -- why do the work twice when you can do it once? Cops never have enough time for all the paperwork they have to do.) And vice versa -- if they're under-reporting crimes, they're going to under-report to the CDC too.

Even though this is a quarter of a century old now, it's worth reading this paper.

Which would be approximately the same one year to the next.

Thanks for proving that you don't read the links I give. If you did, you would know that 2022 had a huge drop in reporting due to the FBI reducing the number of different systems that local LE could use to upload data to them. In 2020 there was a spike in homicides. So yes, crime stats do vary a lot from year to year.

The claimed 13% fall in homicides in 2023 has not been audited by the FBI yet, but even if it is legit, much of that fall is probably return to the mean following the 2020 spike.

Crime stats are hard to collect for many reasons, and large US cities like New York, Chicago, Philly etc have a long history of fudging their numbers. Even for murder -- there's a lot of leeway for LE to classify killings as "death by misadventure", suicide, lawful killing (e.g. self-defence or justifiable homicide) instead of murder -- or vice versa. Cops' bosses can lose their jobs if the number of unsolved murders is too high. They're probably not just inventing homicide numbers from thin air, but a little tweak here, a little tweak there, and before you can say "unreliable data" your stats are worthless.

When people talk about police killing black men, everyone acknowledges that police shootings are under-reported. But those same people suddenly treat police stats as super-reliable when they have an axe to grind that crime rates are falling.

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The data is coming from the same source, so it's not independent.

No. The FBI's UCR system gets their data from law enforcement organizations.

The CDC's NVDRS links data from coroner/medical examiners, toxicology, and death certificates.

If you did, you would know that 2022 had a huge drop in reporting due to the FBI reducing the number of different systems that local LE could use to upload data to them.

You realize that 2023 isn't 2022, right?

And I note that that your information is out of date.

Second, the FBI decided to accept information in the old reporting format where necessary. As a result, the 2022 annual report now includes data from more than 85 percent of agencies (70.4 percent using the new system and 12.9 percent using the old system), covering 93.5 percent of the population.

but even if it is legit, much of that fall is probably return to the mean following the 2020 spike.

No, that would have happened in 2021. A 13% reduction from 2022 to 2023 would only be regression to the mean if there was a spike in 2022.

a long history of fudging their numbers.

So long as the history is long, the estimate of the trend is still good.

everyone acknowledges that police shootings are under-reported.

So long is they're consistently under-reported, the FBI statistics are still good for estimating the trend.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

whataboutism what now?

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Trying to drum up outrage by claiming that undocumented immigrants commit more violent crimes than US citizens ignores the data.

The opposite is the case

We find that undocumented immigrants have substantially lower crime rates than native-born citizens and legal immigrants across a range of felony offenses. Relative to undocumented immigrants, US-born citizens are over 2 times more likely to be arrested for violent crimes, 2.5 times more likely to be arrested for drug crimes, and over 4 times more likely to be arrested for property crimes.

It's not whataboutism. I'm saying that despite 2 (count them ... 1, ... 2) homicides, this demographic is more law abiding and civilized than the average US citizen.

Focusing on the outliers could lead to false impressions.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

(fails to address the point again)

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

If your point wasn't claiming that what i wrote was whataboutism, your response "whataboutism what now?" is inadequate to make your point.

So you want to try again to see if you can even state what your point is?

[–]Questionable 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

If your whataboutism wasn't claiming that what he wrote was the point, your response "If your point wasn't claiming that what i wrote was whataboutism, your response 'whataboutism what now?' is inadequate to make your point." is inadequate to make your point.

So you want to try again to see if you can even state what your point is?

ㅤ ㅤ ㅤ

ㅤ

ㅤ ㅤ ㅤ ㅤ ㅤㅤㅤ ㅤ ㅤ ㅤㅤ ㅤ ㅤ ㅤ ꐕ̖̖̖̖̖̖̭̭̭̰̰̰̱̱̀̀̀̀̀̀̀̀́́̂̂̃̃

[–]ActuallyNot 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If your whataboutism wasn't claiming that what he wrote was the point

it wasn't.

[–]Hematomato 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

He's personally responsible for the fact that someone who came here as a child, almost twenty years ago, recently killed his girlfriend?

Yeah, sure, okay.

[–]weavilsatemyface 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

He's personally responsible for the fact that someone who came here as a child, almost twenty years ago, recently killed his girlfriend?

You got a source for that? Every place I've looked just say he was deported in 2000 at age 25, and illegally re-entered the country some time after that.

[–]Hematomato 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

No, Brandon is 25 now. In 2000, he was one year old.

From what I can piece together, he was brought to the United States as a young child. He graduated from Wyoming High School (in the town of Wyoming, Michigan) and went out and got a job.

Then when he was 21, in 2020, he drove home drunk from the bar and got pulled over. The judge found out he was undocumented and ordered him deported to Mexico.

Not suprisingly, since Brandon really didn't know anyone in Mexico, he made it a priority to sneak back in. Which he successfully did. It's not clear how or when.

And then, fast-forward to now, and he got in a fight with his girlfriend and shot her.

It is fucking preposterous that anyone would consider this all to be the personal fault of one Joseph Robinette Biden, Jr.

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Ah, you're right, I misread or confused myself.

It is fucking preposterous that anyone would consider this all to be the personal fault of one Joseph Robinette Biden, Jr.

Damn straight. We all know it's actually Putin's fault.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

He's responsible for enforcement of national immigration laws, yes. How is this difficult for you people?

[–]Hematomato 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The dude snuck in.

By your logic, if you kill someone, it's the personal fault of your city's chief of police.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

He snuck in ... through a 1000% unguarded border?

[–]Hematomato 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

No, he snuck in past 19,740 border agents.

It's the same number the U.S. employed during the Trump administration, about 2,000 fewer than we employed during the Obama administration, and about 10,000 more than we employed under the Bush administration.

Here you go:

https://www.statista.com/statistics/455866/us-border-patrol-agent-staffing/

Of course, the President doesn't just say "I want this many thousands of border agents." That's a budgetary issue, and one for Congress.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

3 million people walking across last year, is not a guarded border LMAO

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Personally, you say?

Joe Biden walked up to her himself and shot her to death, did he? 🙄

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Who is responsible for the execution of law, if not the person of the Chief Executive?

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Joe Biden didn't pull the trigger. He didn't even give the order to murder that poor woman. The idea that Biden has personal responsibility for this is idiotic. We all know who is really responsible.

It's just another tragic case of domestic violence where a woman ends up dead. Happens hundreds of times a year. You only care because it involves an undocumented migrant.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

(fail to respond)

[–]weavilsatemyface 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Americans when a Latina is killed by a cop, or a white man, or because of poverty or lack of medical care: I sleep

Americans when a Latina is killed by an illegal immigrant: RAGE RAGE RAGE

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This one crossed my feed. Go ahead and post about the rest if you like.

[–]KyleIsThisTall 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The victim was a katina though

[–]KyleIsThisTall 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Yeah but it was a latina

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

and? mexicans are white, you should be upset here