You can't study communication with other species because it oppresses me

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[–]ClassroomPast6178 15 insightful - 3 fun15 insightful - 2 fun16 insightful - 3 fun -  (8 children)

They aren’t wrong about Koko and Nim just signing nonsense but their whining about deaf people being harmed is bollocks.

[–]Alienhunter糞大名 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Yeah this is the problem with this shit. They come out the gate with the "it's problematic because it hurts deaf people" argument that is pretty much indefensible. The rest of it while a rant does contain a lot of legitimate criticisms of a study that while I'd not say is utterly without value is nothing like the popular perception of the case.

Gorillas aren't stupid but they aren't smart enough to he taught human language signed or not. You can similarly train your dog to "ask you" for food. Same with a cat.

The animals figure out that whatever action means you give them food and they go for the pavlovian response there.

[–]ClassroomPast6178 7 insightful - 4 fun7 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 4 fun -  (5 children)

Wasnt as bad as that dolphin study that the researcher ended up shagging the dolphin.

[–]Alienhunter糞大名 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

That was a fun read. Who would of thought that if you jerked off the dolphin it would want more.

[–]LordoftheFliesAmeri-kin 2.0. Pronouns: MegaWhite/SuperStraight/UltraPatriarchy 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Shit, anyone who's ever jerked off a guy would have known that they'd want more of that. It's some basic "give a mouse a cookie" shit.

[–]Alienhunter糞大名 3 insightful - 8 fun3 insightful - 7 fun4 insightful - 8 fun -  (0 children)

If you give a mouse a handy he's gonna want a cigarette to go with it.

[–]Chipit 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

www.dolphinsex.org

From the early 2000s, typed from memory

[–]The_Best_Yak_Ever 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That was buried deeeeep in my brain… and you, the hero, have drawn it back into the open. Haha

[–]Bonn1770 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"Boo hoo I'm a victim now give me more power and legislation to benefits me!"
We need less coddling and more bullying.

[–]Femaleisnthateful 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Actually one of the most based takes I've seen here. TIL chimps are dumber than we think.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Very vicious too.

[–]MikeSopes 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

...like honey?

[–]ClassroomPast6178 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

golf clap

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Phone autocorrect 😑

[–]Tums_is_Smut_bkwrds 3 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 4 fun4 insightful - 5 fun -  (1 child)

This is such a load of shit. Next they'll be telling us that some people can't talk, and that's just dumb.

[–]According-Junket-885 3 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 4 fun4 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

some people can't talk

and that's just dumb.

I see what you did there.

[–]Chipit 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

ASL is weird. It's more like Mandarin Chinese than anything else. And it's American sign language. Other countries have different, mutually incomprehensible languages. Kind of sad, really.

[–]Alienhunter糞大名 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Not really that weird when you think about it. We want to think of sign language as being a one to one relationship with whatever the actual spoken language is, but deaf people don't understand the spoken language at all. It's a completely different and separate thing. No surprise it tends to drop verbal conventions that are unnecessary to get across the meaning while developing its own.

The funny thing is French and ASL sign languages are basically the same. While the British sign language is completely different.

Anyway I had an epiphany years ago that ASL was worthless for me to learn unless I somehow have a deaf family member. Besides the deaf community being filled with unpleasant cunts bitter about people who can hear. If by whatever reason I need to communicate with one I can assume they are literate so we can just use the basic shared communication method we already have, writing.

[–]ClassroomPast6178 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Even if they all started with the same sign language, the way that languages evolve in isolated groups it wouldn’t be long before they were once again mutually incomprehensible. There are dialects of English spoken in England that you would struggle to understand even as a native English English speaker (and I don’t just mean the accent but the actual dialect).

Here’s an example. And here’s what is actually being said

[–]BellaBlue 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Stick a Cockney English, an Appalachian & Creole American in one room and see how well they understand each other.

Add more difficult regional accents for fun 💖

[–]ClassroomPast6178 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

Have you ever seen the video of Patrick Stewart speaking in his native West Riding Yorkshire dialect?

[–]BellaBlue 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

I have now!

[–]William_World 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

bad title but this is fascinating

[–]ID10T 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

The whole Koko thing was total bullshit. I don't know if it harms deaf people specifically. It definitely was a lot of BS though.

[–]William_World 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

it seems like really yhey were annoyed that people wanted to learn ASL cuz they heard apes could do it not cuz they wanted to be able to communicate with Deaf people. Which I kind of get. But I'd rather talk to my dog if I magically could than talk to a chinese guy for example.

[–]Alienhunter糞大名 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

真丟臉。當你無法閱讀時，你就會錯過有趣的對話。儘管我認為傻瓜的美國人對母親的狗和寵物的口味相像。

[–]NerveActive[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Obviously apes will never understand language like we do and the Koko thing was exaggerated. But some animals are smarter than we think and it's an interesting topic of research.

[–]ID10T 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Oh for sure. I’m sure Koko understood some things. I mean my old dog sure as hell knew what ball or walkies meant. But Koko was a total scam.

Seems fairly likely that dolphins and whales communicate at a high level and I would love to know more about it.

[–]Kalkazar13 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You know... I don't see what's wrong here. This deaf guy seems to raise a reasonable point.