The root cause of America’s radicalization and polarization problem

submitted by BioEssentialism from self.TumblrInAction

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[–]LyingSpirit472 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (21 children)

While most of your logic makes sense, I'd posit it goes earlier than the 2008 recession:

The answer to "why does each of these theories require demonizing the majority to prop up the minority?" was helped by the recession, but the real answer is: All politics are glorified sports teams. Your political group, your identity, that's YOUR TEAM, and your team are the heroes right or wrong. The "other" is the enemy. They are literally, inherently evil and they are not to be trusted. Even if they pretend to be on your side, it's a lie, they hate you and everything that you stand for. They want you and everyone you care about dead. Hell, the ones who flat out say they hate you are BETTER than that- at least they respect you enough to admit there's no place for you in their perfect world. You cannot truly live while they draw breath."

So, the answer to the root cause of this radicalization becomes "what chokepoint caused that to happen?", and the answer to me would be: THE 2000 ELECTION. The aftermath of the 2000 election and how it was truly too close to call was the real start of it. The Republicans and Democrats both had a case to say "our guy won, your guy lost!", and it went on for months as Florida was just too close to call, and both sides of the coin truly believed their guy won Florida, and thus was President...and it got to a choke point where both sides truly believed their guy won and the other guy was trying to steal the election...and then suddenly you have that irreconcilable difference between the Republicans and the Democrats. Before 2000, people disagreed with the other party, but after that, the two sides truly HATED each other and believed the other side was out to get them. It was bad enough the only thing to bring people together was 9/11 and the most vicious attack on US soil in history...and even THAT only bought people about 18 months before the Iraq War started and Democrats had the "Saddam Hussein is a fuckhead, but he had nothing to do with 9/11 and we all know it! It's just done for oil prices and your chance to look like a big man to Daddy!", vs. "the war is about getting revenge for 9/11. You don't support 9/11, do you? ...you DO, DON'T YOU? I KNEW you're anti-American! You want us all dead!" and it all derailed quickly. This is important because since then, literally EVERY election, no matter how obvious the result was, has been contested and fought for, and the two sides became more and more convinced there was no reasoning with the other side...and now, it's been 22 years since that election and we're seeing a full generation that has been taught their opposing sides are literally, inherently evil and have no other thoughts in their head except how much they want that person, personally, dead just for existing.

[–]BioEssentialism[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (20 children)

Maybe it’s because I was really young at the time (2000 I was literally only 8) but I don’t remember the country being nearly as divisive as it currently is now, or even started ramping up in the late 00’s-early 2010s. The early to mid 00’s rings as a relatively peaceful time to me, with only 9/11 really being the only thing truly of note. Certainly I don’t remember the fandoms at the time that I grew up with concerning itself with any politics or “problematicness” over what was okay to write let alone this whole special snowflake SJW pronoun brigade.

Was it truly just due to the rise in social media that allowed the public to be exposed to the political underbelly that was the hostility steaming between Dems and Republicans since the 2000 election and allowed it to take surface and enter the mainstream? Cause from what I remember growing up, the early to mid 2000s was no different than the 90’s politics wise.

[–]Alienhunter糞大名 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"The notion of political correctness has ignited controversy across the land. And although the movement arises from the laudable desire to sweep away the debris of racism and sexism and hatred, it replaces old prejudice with new ones. It declares certain topics off-limits, certain expression off-limits, even certain gestures off-limits."

George W. Bush, 1991.

I think the rise of social media just made it so much more easy for the lowest effort emotional takes to gain traction. In the past if you wanted to be politically engaged you actually had to leave the house and meet people or go through newsletters and the like. Everything moved slower, you were less likely to be totally anonymous to whatever group you joined but also less likely to have your neighbors and family know what your opinions were unless you outright told them.

[–]Chipit 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

Yeesh, 2001-2004 was horrible. People unironically calling Bush Bu$hitler and saying he was going to implement a fascist dictatorship. You know Trump Derangement Syndrome? Back then it was called Bush Derangement Syndrome.

And then when Bush was re-elected in 2004, journalists were completely baffled. They did not know anyone who didn't vote for the Democrat and were utterly in the dark about anything outside of their own circles. They sent reporters into darkest middle America to find out what the fuck had happened and how people could be so stupid as to vote for anything but what others thought was best for them. A book, "What's the Matter with Kansas?" spent years on the best-seller lists. Its conclusion was that Americans are too stupid to be allowed to vote and decide what kind of government they want.

[–]Haylstorm 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

People are always like this. Some uni students are despised where I am cause they're like that. Go into a local's pub and let them know they voted liberal democrat or labour for them, aren't you happy i'm helping you? Only to find that people in there voted conservative. Then they get pissy about people voting against their own self interest and basically call them idiots and wonder why no one there is receptive to listening to them. Then they don't listen to WHY people have voted conservative, just continue to call them idiots. Not really helping their case there if you've ever met the stubborn old man at the pub who doesn't like being told what to do.

[–]jet199 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

One of the main things you learn as you get older is that no one votes against their interests.

Rather you just don't understand what their interests are.

People get the politicians the deserve.

[–]Haylstorm 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Honestly a lot of it just seemed to be that they didn't get people had other priorities. The business owner you're talking to doesn't care about family tax breaks but is pretty interested in the business grants a party might want to offer. It's like they don't want to even think about the reasons people might have, they just think the person is stupid and dumb for it. Def pushes people more away.

[–]LyingSpirit472 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

You know Trump Derangement Syndrome? Back then it was called Bush Derangement Syndrome.

Honestly, this ties to the smoking gun for my claim the 2000 election was the tipping point. It's also important to remember that in 2008-2016, it would have been Obama Derangement Syndrome too...and what is the reaction we get now if not Biden Derangement Syndrome?

It's no one derangement syndrome for one party as much as it is an overarching "My guy LOST!" issue both parties have.

[–]Chipit 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

Nah there was no such thing as ODS. People were not losing their shit in public. Not even like it was for Bu$hitler. You'd be reading some thread on fark.com about a tornado in Kansas or something and people would just start foaming at the mouth and screaming for no reason. It was disturbing, and just as bad as TDS. Now, Bu$hitler is fondly remembered as a good guy who just had some bad advice. A painter, an artist, a sensitive soul. Instead of the second coming of fascism and Adolf Hitler, like BDS sufferers constantly shouted.

[–]LyingSpirit472 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

...the Tea Party, and with it the seeds of Trump getting power, formed based on ODS. It's not like every single Republican took Obama's win with kindness and decency and said 'he's not my choice but I hope he does a good job' either. People were losing their shit for him just as much as Bush.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (11 children)

Nah. It wasn't even in the same league.

The Tea Party formed because it was obvious that the GOP didn't represent its voters. Something DC is raging about today as they get their nice comfortable party taken over by the people. They're furious.

[–]LyingSpirit472 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Please. If you don't believe the Tea Party had a undercurrent of Obama Derangement Syndrome as well and you truly believe every Republican was a good, honest person who truly put all their support behind Obama and had no problem with him being in charge, then you're either blind, stupid, or were one of them and don't want to admit that Republicans can be as bad as Democrats. I'd say you'd probably think Biden Derangement Syndrome has nothing to do with "Biden won" and everything to do with whatever good reason you point to, but Democrats would have said "no, no, we had good reasons to hate Bush/Trump" too.

[–]Chipit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Bush Derangement Syndrome was nothing like the reaction to Obama. Literally not the same thing. Not in the same ballpark, not even the same sport.

And Trump Derangement Syndrome was over the top. People literally checked themselves into mental hospitals because they couldn't handle it.

There's literally nothing such as Biden derangement syndrome. It doesn't exist.

you truly believe every Republican was a good, honest person who truly put all their support behind Obama and had no problem with him being in charge, then you're either blind, stupid, or were one of them and don't want to admit that Republicans can be as bad as Democrats.

"An absurd absolute is a restatement of the other person's reasonable position as an absurd absolute. For example, if your point is there is high crime in Detroit, the absurd absolute would be your debate opponent saying something such as "So, you're saying every person in Detroit is a criminal." When your debate opponent recasts your opinion to include an "absolute" word, such as every, always, never, all, completely, universally, and the like, you are seeing cognitive dissonance.

Some people call what I just described a strawman argument. But a strawman argument refers to any sort of inaccurate recasting of your opponent's argument. That is the generic case. I'm referring to a specific strawman argument that uses an absurd absolute. When your debate opponent recasts your point as an absurd absolute, you won the debate. That's as far as you can go."

https://www.scottadamssays.com/2017/05/15/how-to-know-you-won-a-political-debate-on-the/

[–]LyingSpirit472 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

On the second claim, then my reasoning to use an absolute there is:

Bush Derangement Syndrome was nothing like the reaction to Obama. Literally not the same thing. Not in the same ballpark, not even the same sport.

It was. It absolutely was. MAYBE, if I want to give you SOME point, it was because people were so deranged about Bush that Republicans gave it back to them over Obama, then it might have a case, but Republicans were as deranged over Obama as Democrats were over Bush. And even giving that POSSIBLE reason, it goes to...

There's literally nothing such as Biden derangement syndrome. It doesn't exist.

...yeah, if you claim absolutes, you are absolutely a moron if you believe Biden Derangement Syndrome doesn't exist, you are absolutely so pro-Trump you believe every single Trump supporter firmly was in the side of Biden even though people literally tried to rush the Capitol to try and overthrow the election results because they believed the election was stolen, not only are you absolutely blind if you truly believe Biden Derangement Syndrome doesn't exist, but you probably don't even know Braille to feel out the fact that Biden Derangement Syndrome absolutely exists, just like Obama Derangement Syndrome absolutely existed- and to deny it just proves you are absolutely doing the same accusation of cognitive dissonance you accuse me of. Never before in the history of humanity have the words "no u" been more accurate.