What is up with "lesbians" who meet their exception?

submitted by Astrid2448 from self.Lesbians

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[–][deleted] 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I can’t imagine how shitty it is to come out after being married to a dude and I think it would actually be a total bummer because the community is horrible and crazy right now, the worst it’s ever been, and I’ve spoken to other late bloomers who are really struggling to understand why lesbians are being so gatekeeping with other lesbians etc. You would definitely have a much much different experience of coming out than any of us and that is not something I envy.

That master doc is horrendous. I feel bad for all the women who are freaking out and confused and read that goddamn thing. It makes the craziest things into “you’re a lesbian!” It reads like conversion therapy, the shit the right wingers LITERALLY ACCUSE US OF DOING, recruiting. I’m a gold star and I don’t relate to the majority of it.

And you’re right, it’s not a cure, it’s not full of accepting people, dating is not great, and it’s harder to be a lesbian than ever. Those people sound like they are living in a fantasy world.

And yes, lots of lesbians will be suspicious of you. For sure. It’s hurtful and it sucks, but the good ones for you will listen. You can see why we don’t trust anyone these days. It’s honestly not even about late bloomers, it’s about the community in general. We are on edge. I don’t blame you for being like wtf in the lb community and then wtf in TL or here when you see how suspicious we are. It wasn’t like this before. Just stick around

Edit: you’re not stupid, either. You figure it out when you figure it out. It just sucks to figure it out later because people get scared. Not your fault and it doesn’t make you stupid.

[–]CJLez 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

That master doc is horrendous.

I had only skimmed the masterdoc once before and a couple of bits I related to but I've just been re-reading it fully and some parts really are terrible, esspecially...

Now a common misconception is also thateveryone is born knowing they are gay and that’s not necessarily true. It canbe because of both nature AND nurture. If you have had terrible experienceswith men and now would like to no longer date them because you don’t seeyourself being truly happy with a man and would only like to date women,you can be a lesbian too. It’s okay to try on the lesbian identity and see howit fits you because many lesbians were unsure of how they felt about menuntil they identified as lesbians.

It's true that not everybody has the terminology to describe their same-sex attraction (I thought I was the only 'lesbian' in the whole world until I was 13 because it was pre-internet and nobody had told me that some people weren't straight) but saying that it is nature and nurture is literally saying that having a bad time with men can turn someone into a lesbian rather than it being an inate sexuality that you discover later on. Fucking hell. Talk about political lesbianism 101. If you don't want to date men you can just stay single.

Knowing you’re attracted to women, but feeling weirdly guilty and uncomfortabletrying to interact with them as a straight man, and only later realizing you’reactually a trans lesbian

Oh boy.

Knowing you’re gay, but experiencing a lot of the symptoms of comp het whenyou try to interact with men romantically/sexually, and only later realizing you’rea trans lesbian and not a gay man

I don't even have words for that one. Know that you're gay but experience zero same sex attraction? It proves that 'gay/lesbian' is just a fun little label for some people.

hint: 100% straight women do exist

I don't know why it is so easy for people to understand that there are people who only experience opposite-sex attraction but can't wrap their heads around people who only experience same-sex attraction. This document feels like it is defining lesbian as anything from 99% attraction to men up to 100% attraction to women. Bisexual is not a bad word.

Ifyou are unsure or questioning, feel free to try on the lesbian label as well

Again, not a label.

[–][deleted]  (1 child)

[deleted]

    [–][deleted] 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

    That’s what I thought when I read it. I should do a word count on the number of times it says “men” compared to “women.” Because honestly, I’ve never in my whole entire life read anything so man-centered that is meant to define lesbianism or same-sex attraction. That should answer the question right there. If you’re thinking this much about every man-thing you do and so little about women, you ain’t a homo, sis. Lol

    [–][deleted] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

    Also: they take literally every single possible scrap of evidence of a female being literally into men and debunk it. It’s all “you don’t really like men even though you like men” “you want attention from men but you don’t want it because you want it” “all those men you think are attractive are not actual real attractions” “all those celebrities and male fictional characters you like are all just you being hot for fake men because you’re actually a lesbian and don’t have to date them” “when I man you like likes you back and you immediately don’t like him it’s because you’re actually gay”

    It’s so dumb. It’s like telling women it’s actually impossible to be straight or bi. It’s such a weird fucking thing

    [–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    If I felt even 50% of those things about men at all, ever, I would have been relieved to maybe not have to be a lesbian. And I came out in a really really homophobic time. Sexual orientation is complex, but it is some pretty extreme mental gymnastics to say that women who feel most of those things about men are not bisexual, at the very least.

    [–][deleted] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    I am more concerned about how they assign “maybe gay” values to random stuff like not wanting to fuck random dudes but liking the “idea of being with a man.” Yeah, most women are not attracted to most guys. Most lesbians are not into every lesbian. Being nervous about something or being averse to something or having a bad experience of something can all make you not want that thing, it doesn’t mean you’re a damn lesbian, or bi, or straight. Jesus.

    [–]yousaythosethings 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

    For a hot minute I bought into the hateful, gatekeeping, bi-phobic lesbian rhetoric. But I peaked pretty quickly and suddenly it all made sense and I saw the propaganda for what it was.

    It’s honestly crazy how manipulative the media is in presenting the Get The L Out movement, for example. It’s all “these old ugly boring ass lesbians blame trans and queer people for their problems” with no attempt to present the lesbian perspective.

    One of the most eye-opening concepts to me in my life has been “The Missing Missing Reasons.” I learned about it in the context of understanding the gaslighting I received from my narcissistic mom, but it applies generally to propaganda and other narcissistic behavior: http://www.issendai.com/psychology/estrangement/missing-reasons-given.html . So I sensed that something was off here and had to dig hard to find out what it was. I actually unintentionally documented my peaking thought process in texts to my friend so I can look back and see what was running through my head. It took about 3 weeks between my initial peaking to reach full comprehension and stop making excuses for TRAs and fully embrace lesbian gatekeeping.

    [–][deleted] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    Yeah, unfortunately I have heard people say lesbians are all mean, old, fat, ugly, dykes and no one wants to be lesbians and they are just hateful etc and none of those people are able to see past their own feelings on the issue into what lesbians have been experiencing. Yes, there are lots of lesbians behaving badly over all of these issues and being mean when they shouldn’t. But to act like it comes from “ugliness and oldness” is like associating anything else with virtuousness, when shallow people are anything but pure. Lesbians are not inherently terrible people. We are the ones who have actually been welcoming to the other letters of the alphabet soup, but people forget that when they want it all.

    [–][deleted] 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

    I am sure you are noticing a lot of very solipsistic behaviour from the TRAs. It is recognized by any of us who had parents or family who are pathologically selfish.