DiscussionHow do I learn to love trans people and the trans movement

submitted by fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve from (self.LGBDropTheT)

This sounds like a joke post but it's unfortunately not.

((My last post on s/gendercritical can provide any context if you want it - about my friend living in la la land.))

I was pretty much virtually intervention'd lately by my friends recently, they said they've been noticing I can say sort of "terf"y things and maybe be unintentionally ignorant about trans people.

Okay. The problem is I'm not ignorant, I know how I feel. I know how I feel about feminism especially, and about lgb issues especially, and how the tq conflicts. But unfortunately it still stands that though I did not make my friends in lgb(tq) spheres, they are all followers of lgb(tq) rhetoric. This is the truth I am living with. My friends wouldn't stand for my true viewpoints. And considering where I live, the chance any new friends will either is very slim.

I feel I have no other option than to just be... what, a little more tolerant? More knowledgable?... I can't help but feel like I already have a strong sense of reality that's unshakable, but the fact still stands that... this is happening. Trans people are here, and my friends either love them or consider themselves to be one. Every person my age I meet in my area is the same, either loves them or is one.

For all the ranting I do on the internet, this is my real life. What can I do? I guess I need to accept that nonbinary people are real the same way money is real. I need to accept that my friends notice when I call a transwoman "they" and not "she" and it's a problem...

I don't know, I'm just sort of spilling out my consciousness. Is anyone out there at all in the same boat?

1) these are my closest friends for years, it's not as easy as "drop them and find smarter friends" because 2) this is literally the reality of where I live. Everybody is like this, they move here to be like this. It's inescapable.

How do I reprogram myself? Not to believe in complete nonsense but to, I don't know... I guess at least believe them?? And stop getting so uncomfortable and mad everytime someone wants to talk about trans things?? Because fuck it's here to stay at least for me.

Help.

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[–]FrostyNugsI'm allergic to nuts 16 insightful - 16 fun16 insightful - 15 fun17 insightful - 16 fun -  (0 children)

Step 1: Turn off your brain.

Step 2: Repeat "trans women are women" 500 times every night before you sleep

Step 3: Start browsing r/AL and upvote all of the posts talking about kawaii uwu girldick, and also participate in the Daily Transwoman Validation posts

And then, you're ready for the final step! Step 4 is to get an ugly haircut, dye it blue, and call yourself queer! When anyone asks about it, you are supposed to say: "Not gay as in acceptable to the cis-heteronormative colonialist patriarchy, but QUEER as in fuck you" and smirk because you have just totally owned them. I hope this helps UwU.

[–]Madsea 23 insightful - 1 fun23 insightful - 0 fun24 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I’m only going to speak for myself, but I wouldn’t maintain friendships that require me to gaslight myself to feel accepted. The friendships are conditional and transactional, which doesn’t sound much like friendship at all.

I have plenty of friends who I disagree with on major issues. One of my best friends is very religious. I am an atheist. We disagree on so much. And yet we have very productive and respectful conversations, find common ground, and still love one another at the end of the day. Neither of us demands the other change her views.

Find better friends? (I realized you said it’s hard in your area and you have my empathy. I’ve managed to find better friends since I was canceled and my mental health is so much better now.)

[–]fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve[S] 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why were you cancelled and how'd you find better friends?

[–]VioletRemiCat, homosexual one 21 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 0 fun22 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You don't.

Living as a hostage is not a "friendship". In general, you just do not speak about those topics with them and that's all. People are different. I don't think that everyone is only talking about this stuff. In worst case scenario - just try searching older women.

[–]haveanicedaytoo💗💜💙 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Don't do this to yourself. If all these people moved to your city so that they could worship trans dick, that's fine. That just means you either need to move someplace else where trans dick isn't worshipped, or you need to look harder. You are not the only human being in your city that feels like we do about TRA's.

I know it's extremely hard. There are so many people out there trapped in abusive families that are held hostage by one delusional asshole, and everyone else has to tiptoe around the asshole and not rock the boat. Your friends are like that asshole. You have to constantly edit and censor yourself or you'll get in trouble. This will cause you anxiety and damage your emotional/mental health and give you stress.

Unfortunately, we live in the time of Corona, or I'd tell you to go volunteer at old folk homes just so you can hang out with people who have no clue WTF "nonbinary" or "trans" is. I think because you are so surrounded by trans-dick worshippers, you feel like EVERYONE where you live is like this (and I'm sure a majority of them are, I lived in a west coast city like this too.) But there are also a ton of them just like you, who are just pretending to go along with it for their own personal safety.

Unfortunately, coming out to people like that isn't always safe either.

For example, my country is a Muslim country, but there are many atheists, but we are all hiding. Even if I meet a lady and I'm 99.99999% sure she is an atheist because of how she's acting and what she's saying, I can't come out and just tell her I'm an atheist too, because she might not want to come out and be atheists together, she might be terrified that her cover is blown and start running around telling everyone I'm an atheist just to show everyone that she's OBVIOUSLY TOTALLY NOT an atheist, she might not be ready to even admit to herself that she's an atheist yet. I've seen this in the gay community too. A gay guy comes out to a dude who is obviously into him, and then the dude freaks out and gets totally homophobic and outs the gay guy to everybody. And then 6 months later you see the guy, and he has a boyfriend and is all contrite about his shitty actions. And it's like... Just because you decided to be gay now, it doesn't exempt you from all the horrible things you did to that first gay guy, you ruined his life just because he escalated your flirtation and wanted to speak to you about it openly. (Sorry this is based on an IRL thing that happened to my friend. Anyway...)

So I'm saying you're DEFINITELY not alone, but you have to be extremely careful. There are too many cowards out there pretending to worship trans dick just for their own personal safety and they won't think twice about sacrificing you.

You need to think of a future without your friends, possibly in a different neighborhood or a different part of the country/world.

[–]reluctant_commenter 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You are not the only human being in your city that feels like we do about TRA's.

Seconding this. I live in a very TQ-happy area and there are still many people who don't buy in or, at least, don't buy it even though they use pronouns to be polite.

In my experience, people who realize TQ ideology is bullshit are often quieter about it than the TQ people are-- often because they've just got other things going on in their lives that they are interested in.

edit: Also, those are really good examples!

[–][deleted] 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Do you live with abusers and force you to love your abusers? You don't. You find better friends.

[–]slushpilot 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

You're not going to convince them; they're not going to convince you.

It's perfectly good to just say "I have my own thoughts on this, and I'd rather not argue about it with my best friends". If they can't tolerate that, it really shows who is being the intolerant one.

[–]fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That directly implies that my thoughts are unsavory about the topic, and that's not okay. It's not a "live and let live" kind of thing to these people. It's not to any one of my peers.

[–]slushpilot 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I know it implies that you disagree, but you have a right to your private thoughts. It must be okay to "live and let live". It's the bare minimum for a functioning society.

[–]Rosefield 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

What even is this post?? You come to "Lgb drop the T" to ask how to believe all this gender identity nonsense?? This has to be a joke. Perhaps you can believe it when you learn to believe the earth is flat, snow is hot & pigs have wings & 3 heads.

[–]fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Wish it was a joke

[–]BiHorror 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

call a transwoman "they" and not "she" and it's a problem.

I also do this, and get funny looks. They'll have to learn to deal with this. Which, if anything, should be grateful for since there's another term that starts with an I that could've been used instead.

Also, don't. Don't do that to yourself. Yes, while this may have been your friend for years... This "reprogram" mindset is wack. You can start by finding other people who also have the same opinions as you, maybe online first, until you can leave the area. I too get annoyed when trans things get brought up, and I (for most part) walk away from it.

[–]xanditAGAB (Assigned Gay at Birth) 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

good advice from others already, at best you can just tell them you don't hate trans people (unless you do lol) but you believe in biological sex and everything that comes from that like sexual orientation not being gender bases. they came to give you an intervention- from your own opinions? No, they came to ensure you believe as they do. Those don't seem like real friends. If some of them agree to disagree but stay your friends, those are keepers. The rest will drop you and prove they aren't worth keeping. It's a tough choice, but maybe you can find like minded people elsewhere. It's kinda like being LGB in a hostile place, you have to find out who is just pretending to believe in the tq+ rhetoric. It's only gonna get worse with these people.

[–]fuckupaddamsBisexual Terve[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

unless you do lol

I don't, in fact I think there are like 50 shades (sorry) of different views one can have on gender, and I think mine is pretty damn reasonable and quite a bit liberal + rational. Unfortunately it's not blindly shooting off into the most "left" direction so I'm suspicious. All this advice is great but it's not practical. I can't say anything remotely of the sort that everyone's suggesting. I need to be an empty slate, quietly accepting the new monthly rhetoric, or at least positively and actively engaging when others bring it up or I'm acting 'sus' hah. what the fuck. Really it's just my closest friend. They (I guess im used to it by now) are sort of a fanatic about this stuff. But it spreads and then others need to come out and agree and I'm the odd one out...

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Avoid the topic and take a nuanced approach if they ask you? Like, you can simultaneously think that the trans activist rhetoric is a load of bull and without denying the existence of trans people. Something like what jk rowling wrote could work. Also, why not put some of the onus on them? Why is your friendship based upon political views re trans issues? Why are they being judgemental? Don't they have better things to talk about? Are you not allowed to disagree without your friends? — if not, that doesn't sound like a good group dynamic.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's simple. You don't. You sound young. Don't allow yourself to be placed in situations that you don't like.

What would you be a "yes" man? It's disrespectful to yourself. And I am insulted that you even asked yourself these questions.

[–]HelloMomo 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Straight folks actually can make pretty good friends, and they're usually less homophobic than queer folks. I recommend them.