Drag queens and transvestism is gender appropriation and ‘womanface’

submitted by Kally from self.GenderCritical

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[–]BEB 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

I myself would agree with you, but there are some black feminists who find the comparison offensive and, as I'm not black, I will bow to their wishes.

The good news is now there are quite a few examples of women especially being cancelled for cultural appropriation: Hilaria Baldwin, and a couple (?) of women who pretended to be Latina.

SJWs get worked up about cultural appropriation too, so it's a good way to point out their hypocrisy - what is the difference between trans-gender and trans-cultural?

Well, trans-gender are appropriating biology and women's specific oppression. And now there are examples of transgenders taking the places of actual women, especially in academia and sports. TiMs also put women's safety, privacy and dignity at risk.

The trans-cultural pretenders have gotten mileage out of appropriating other cultures but don't put anyone's lives or safety at risk.

And culture is much more fluid. A white growing up surrounded by Latinos in the US Southwest or California might feel like an honorary Latino, and "appropriate" their food and celebrations in a respectful manner, just as Latinos and other ethnic groups "appropriate" traditional American culture.

And so many Americans are mixed-race/ ethnicity - where do they fit in the cultural appropriation outrage?

The trans-cultural / trans-gender comparison is apt, and likely not to offend anyone, so I'm going to use that going forward.

[–]Kally[S] 6 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 2 fun -  (11 children)

I AM black!!!!!! 😡

[–]BEB 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

As I said, I find the comparison apt, but I am not going to offend the black feminists who are offended by using it.

However, I myself really dislike it when a few people of a group claim to speak for the majority. For instance, you and I are both women, but guaranteed we have very different views on many things, so why should one of us be allowed to tell the world, "I am a woman, and as a woman I find that offensive so don't do it." and the world is forced by social pressure to bow down to my opinion, when you, another woman, might disagree?

Anyway, as a black woman yourself I'm guessing no one, except perhaps other blacks, will feel they have the right to correct your comparison, so...

[–]MarkTwainiac 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I suspected you might be when I first read and responded to your post. My comments still stand.

As I said, some black women have objected to the comparison of "womanface" to "blackface," but other black women have not and say they think the analogy and term are apt. However, the sentiments and case made by the black women I've heard and read arguing against it have, IMO, been stronger than the feelings and case made by those who've argued for it, regardless of their race. Moreover, a large number of people - perhaps the majority - who have argued for the use of such terms as "gender blackface" and "womanface" are not black.

As a result, in deference to those black women who've raised strong objections, I've decided to eschew the term and analogy, and would want to see evidence a large proportion of black women embrace the term and analogy before abandoning caution.

Moreover, given how racist proponents of trans ideology are - and how often trans-identified males and those who argue on their behalf liken being a TIM to being a black woman, and liken sex segregation to racist practices and policies of the past such as Jim Crow and apartheid - I think it's best not to mix up race and sex when discussing gender ideology. After all, trans ideologues constantly invoke the history of racism to make the preposterous claims that sex itself is a "social construct" like race is, that the concept of sex invented by white supremacists in order to advance white supremacy, and therefore anyone who "believes in" biological sex and says there are differences between males and females is by definition a racist white supremacist.

[–]Rationalmind 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Agree about the culture bit that you pointed out. It’s a good point. I wonder, however, whether then men could argue that women should not wear pants because we typically wore dresses? It should be fair in terms of drawing a line around our boundaries. Personally, I do not care whether men wear dresses. I care when men try to pretend they are women. Drag is an exaggeration on womanhood and I am fairly conflicted about this. I find it offensive when they use “fishy” or the b or c-words because they are jokes at the expense of women.

Sorry that others are invalidating your perspective because they are speaking up for others (some black feminists) offensiveness and not speaking from their own viewpoint. Reasonable minds can differ, and those minds can speak up directly if they feel offended for themselves.

[–]Kally[S] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

The only reason men wear dresses is to pop a boner. I hate it when people act like Harry Styles is such a saint when he’s a white male appropriating my feminity.

[–]uwushallnotpass 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Meh. He can have my femininity, I’m not using it.

I’m really not interested in dictating which shapes of cloth men and women should wear on their bodies. If it was perfectly normal for both boys and girls to wear whatever they felt like, pink flowery skirts and glittery makeup, combat boots and pants, whatever, there wouldn’t be a fetish for adult men to dress as women. The whole point is that dress codes for women and girls are repressive, we’re supposed to dress femininely to please men. That’s what the fetish is about.

[–]Kally[S] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

This one doesn’t understand. Women can dress masculine or feminine but men can only dress masculine. Women can be free to be and dress how they want. But men can’t. It’s laws of nature and matriarchy. If you don’t like it you’re not a real feminist.

[–]uwushallnotpass 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

Yes, you're right. The laws of nature dictate exactly which shapes of cloth should be worn on human bodies. Any aberrant behaviour that doesn't fit in with cultural preconceptions of masculine and feminine should be punished, and that's what feminism is all about. Yup.

[–]Kally[S] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

You’re defending a straight white male you fucking imbecile!

[–]Rationalmind 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Oh yea, I totally agree. Harry Styles in a dress is weird. In practice I don’t really approve of celebrating aberrant behavior. In theory, I don’t mind, but I won’t be celebrating Harry Styles in a dress. It’s not brave imo, it is just weird.

[–]Kally[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Finally! Someone here with a fucking brain! Thankyou! It is weird! And Harry Styles is a virtue signalling piece of shit!

[–]Kally[S] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I can’t believe so many chicks are thirsty for a straight white male!