Why do Trans Men want to go to All Women Colleges?

submitted by rudeboy96 from (self.GenderCritical)

I went to an all-women college to get away from men but when do TIF want to attend all-women colleges? Like, this is meant to be a space for women but you want to be a man and still attend this space? The madness of it all.

I loved my all-women college experience. I loved living on a campus where there were no men around. Why do you want to transition as a man as yet want to be in an all-women's college? Then, women can't say anything because they don't want to be known as a bigot. IT IS A HOT MESS.

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[–]VioletRemi 32 insightful - 5 fun32 insightful - 4 fun33 insightful - 5 fun -  (9 children)

Same reason why they do not want to go to male prison, or prefering female toilets. It is extra dangerous for them to be there.

And in general it seems that men's places are left unchecked and for men only, while women's places are now "everyone who is not male and identifies as man is here" - enbies of both sexes, transgenders of both sexes, and women.

[–]koreansmallpeepee 17 insightful - 2 fun17 insightful - 1 fun18 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

yeah. we should have more TIFs trolling the male-only spaces, the boys club. this is the only way the straight males that hold all the power will care about this bat shit crazy trans agenda.

but since TIFs are women, and they grew up consuming female socilization, they do not go around demanding shite like TIMs do. such an unfair fight from the beginning.

[–]VioletRemi 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Sadly, but so far they are only attacking gay men, which is not making much difference, as they are already marginalized by straight men. Seems like transgender movement is basically MRA and attacking marginalized groups of people only.

[–]MarkTwainiac 13 insightful - 3 fun13 insightful - 2 fun14 insightful - 3 fun -  (3 children)

But the choice isn't whether to go to an all women's college or an all men's college. The question is, why do so many TIFs choose to go to an all women's college as opposed to a mixed-sex one.

In the US, most institutions of higher learning are mixed sex. This has been the case for 50 years.

The male-only Ivies and all other colleges and universities in the US that historically admitted only males - and did not have already established female "sister" schools the way Columbia did with Barnard, Harvard did with Radcliffe, Brown did with Pembroke, and Notre Dame did with St Mary's - such as Georgetown and Johns Hopkins started admitting women as undergraduates in the late 1960s.

The last Ivy League school to admit women was Dartmouth; it decided to accept applications from women in 1971, the first women matriculated there in 1972. Wesleyan began matriculating female undergrads in 1972 too.

The last all-male holdouts in the USA were Haverford and Columbia, which started matriculating female undergrads in 1980 and 1983 respectively.

Eventually, at many sister-brother schools where undergrads of both sexes had long attended class together but females and males were admitted via different admissions departments, were subject to different rules and got differently-named diplomas - such as Radcliffe-Harvard and Pembroke-Brown - merged admissions, made all the rules uniform, and gave all students the same Harvard or Brown diploma.

There are still brother-sister schools - such as Hobart and William Smith and Yeshiva and Stern colleges - where male and female students officially are enrolled at two separate institutions. But these institutions are effectively mixed-sex.

And in general it seems that men's places are left unchecked and for men only, while women's places are now "everyone who is not male and identifies as man is here" - enbies of both sexes, transgenders of both sexes, and women.

This isn't true anymore when it comes to higher education in the US. Though American higher education traditionally was a bastion of male exclusivity and privilege, nearly all college and universities in the US today are mixed-sex - or as we used to say, "co-educational."

Today in 2020, there are more than 30 female-only accredited, four-year, secular, degree-granting colleges in the US, but only three that remain male-only: Wabash in Indiana, Hampden-Sydney in Virginia and Morehouse in Atlanta, GA.

And Morehouse, an HCBU, doesn't really count as exclusively male, coz it long has allowed females from its sister school - the all female Spelman College - and other institutions to register for and attend courses for credit. What's more, Morehouse announced in 2019 that it would start admitting "transgender men" in 2020.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/14/us/morehouse-college-transgender.html

In the US, even military colleges and most/many religious schools became mixed sex quite a while ago as well. The only religious schools that remain male-only are a handful of Christian seminaries where men study for the priesthood/clergy, and a number of orthodox Jewish where men study to be rabbis. The vast majority of the colleges/unis in the USA that are male-only are orthodox Jewish rabbinical schools.

Moreover, in mixed sex schools US unis and colleges generally today, female undergrads outnumber male ones.

Same reason why they do not want to go to male prison, or prefering female toilets. It is extra dangerous for them to be there.

There's absolutely no justifiable reason why a TIF would need to go to a female-only school. There's plenty of room for them on the majority of US college and uni campuses that are mixed-sex. Women in mixed sex schools have achieved or exceeded enrollment and other kinds of parity with men. And they are perfectly safe there!

It is extra dangerous for them to be there.

Even if a TIF were to go a male-only school such as Morehouse - which as I said, is now admitting TIFs - I don't think this would be the case. I have some experience in this area, coz I went to a college in the 1970s that prior to the year I entered had been all-male for hundreds of years, and where the female students initially were very small in number (150 women to 4000+ men). Prior to deciding to go to that college I looked at the experience of the first women to attend other all-male schools, and for 50 years I've followed what's happened to the women at my uni and others who were the first to break the sex barriers.

It wasn't always fun to be in the small minority of women on an overwhelmingly male campus like that. Some of the male students who had started their college years going to an all-male school felt lots of hostility towards the new female students, whom they saw as interlopers - and some of these men were misogynistic and verbally abusive, whilst others - and the professors too - were "merely" sexist and "male chauvinist." At the same time, though, many of the guys were glad to be of a generation that was breaking ground on behalf of greater equality between the sexes and they welcomed us.

Also, we women had our own toilets and showers, and our own dorms or floors in mixed-sex dorms.

But even with all the difficulties, attending a previously male-only school that was still mostly male was nothing like being locked in a male prison. At all. Coz there's a big difference between a penitentiary full of convicted male criminals and a college campus full of ordinary young men.

What's more, as the school I went to was a "highly selective" school where only about 10% of applicants got in, the young men there were those with histories of good grades and high SAT scores who'd had to meet rigorous admission standards, and whose identities were known. Sure, there were frat guy assholes and actual or wanna-be sex abusers of the Kavanaugh and "Animal House" type. But it wasn't full of hardened criminal men convicted of violent crimes like murder, rape, assault, child sex abuse, armed robbery, sex trafficking and such the way male prisons in the US are. Nor was it "run" by male gangs. Honestly, it really wasn't any more physically dangerous for us women than colleges or unis that had been mixed-sex for longer were at the time.

[–]VioletRemi 7 insightful - 5 fun7 insightful - 4 fun8 insightful - 5 fun -  (2 children)

Assuming everyone is from US is so american ;)

This isn't true anymore

I was speaking there more about toilets, sports, shelters, etc.

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Yes, I know. But you drew a direct analogy between sex-segregated prisons and toilets and colleges and universities. Even when you throw in sports, shelters and all other sex-segregated programs, provisions and facilities, the analogy to institutions of higher learning doesn't hold up. For a whole slew of reasons.

You suggested that the only alternative to TIFs going to an all-female uni or college would be for them to go to an all-male one. That was a big leap in reasoning. And it's a leap that has no basis in the reality of higher education in the USA and the rest of the West in 2020.

You further said TIFs go to all-female colleges and unis coz "it would be extra dangerous" for them to go to ones that aren't all-female coz in your view the only colleges and unis that aren't all-female are those that are all-male.

Finally, you said

And in general it seems that men's places are left unchecked and for men only, while women's places are now "everyone who is not male and identifies as man is here" - enbies of both sexes, transgenders of both sexes, and women.

I just pointed out that in higher education, this is not true. In the US and the rest of the West, higher ed institutions that are for men only are few and far between nowadays, coz they are hard to justify. By contrast, women have had more success at ring-fencing female-only colleges and unis to keep them female-only, coz cogent arguments can be made to justify this.

I don't think making analogies that don't hold up or claims that aren't true benefits anyone.

[–]VioletRemi 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Mixed toilets is not the same as mixed education, tho. In mixed toilets and bathrooms is the highest rate of rape cases, for women statistically safer to go into males-only ones than to mixed ones.

Plus in male-only or mixed-college - TiF will most likely live in male dormitory in male room.

In the US and the rest of the West

Actually in US, UK, Japan and Korea (and, well, India) - is the biggest amount of women-only or men-only colleges in the world. In general, most single-sex colleges and schools are religious ones, tho.

[–]Killer_Danish 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah, "women" has become a dumping ground for "non-men"

[–]Monchichi 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It's not extra dangerous for them. The transgender population are far safer in an all-male population than women would be. And the choice isn't between an all-male college or an all-female college (plus a college isn't in any way comparable to a prison). They have no reason to be in an all-woman college rather than a mixed one. Let's not pretend like this is about security rather than fetishization.

[–]VioletRemi 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They are demanding to get to gay men places and want to date gay men, that is fetishization, why then they want female-only spaces or schools in every other scenario?

[–]BEB 20 insightful - 2 fun20 insightful - 1 fun21 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Formerly all-women college, Mills College, now has a really strange TiM for a Distinguished Chair in Women's Leadership. He seems like a creepy, angry guy.

How despicable that a women's college would not only hire a man to fill a position specifically designated for a woman, but also a man full of rage seemingly against women and society itself.

https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/09/23/fighting-the-new-culture-wars-mills-college-hires-pioneering-transgender-historian-and-activist/

[–]PeakingPeachEater 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Found this snippet from the article:

The Oklahoma-born Stryker knows how cultural forces use people’s identity against them. When she he came out, the American Psychiatric Association classified gender dysphoria or gender identity disorder as a mental health issue, which encouraged discourse on viewing trans people through a “pathologizing framework.”

So...I DON'T understand how having gender dysphoria or gender identity DISORDER are not considered a mental health issue??? Like, if your brain(mental) supposedly doesn't match your body(issue), isn't that...nevermind.

Anyways the next quote:

"Imagine, if you were heterosexual person, and you think, ‘I really like that guy, but before I go out with him, I have to go to a psychologist have and get a certificate that says I have something called opposite sex identity attraction disorder and I have to go through two years of trial dating to make sure I get approved for a long-term relationship,’” Stryker said. “That’s what it was like to be trans. It was maddening.”

This is a logical fallacy---a false analogy. In no way is a sexuality the same as gender identity. Of course he needs to be checked for Gender DYSPHORIA/Gender Identity DISORDER, so he can get the help he needs! It's considered a mental health ISSUE. Yes, it's not normal to have gender dysphoria, this is coming from someone who had it in my formative years...

[–]BEB 7 insightful - 4 fun7 insightful - 3 fun8 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah - logic from trans activists doesn't happen. But why Mills College made itself a laughingstock by hiring this guy is beyond me...

[–]Omina_Sentenziosa 19 insightful - 2 fun19 insightful - 1 fun20 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Because they are hypocrites and don't believe the shit they say.

[–]sisterinsomnia 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The principle is to have your cake and to save it, too. I see this for nonbinary female-bodied people, too. Both groups want everything, i.e., to not be treated shittily like women are treated, but to still share in all the fruits from feminists work and, in fact, to be prioritised in that work so that we cannot say 'pregnant women' but must say 'pregnant people'. We must be inclusive and so destroy our ability to see the female biological sex as the reason for our oppression because it is now just something that applies to 'people' in general.

[–]jet199 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Because they aren't stupid.

A couple of detrans women were saying the other day they they were ultra against gatekeeping on cross sex hormones when TRA because one of the things therapists have traditionally done with trans patients, previously mostly TiMs, is ask them to dress as a woman and use women's spaces for a good few years before they even think about getting hormones let alone surgery. TiFs know full well this would not be safe for them so push for drugs first. They don't want to go anywhere near a men's toilet unless they have a full beard on.

[–]Franklintheturtle 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

but gender neutral colleges exist. Its not like a bathroom where you usually have to choose between a man's and a woman's bathroom. Why go to a woman's college if you don't consider yourself a woman?

[–]MarkTwainiac 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I dunno what you mean by "gender neutral colleges." But mixed-sex ones not only exist, they constitute the vast majority in countries like the USA today. Single-sex colleges and unis are vanishingly rare.

It is indeed strange that women who don't consider themselves women would want to go to one of the small number of women's colleges that remain today when there are many thousands of mixed-sex institutions they can go to. There are approximately 30-35 women's colleges in the US today, but more than 4,000 that are open to males and females alike.

[–]lulululululu 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I attended a women's college too, before TIMs were allowed but there were still lots of TIFs. Every time people tried to ask this question, the TIFs would do mental gymnastics before ultimately just calling them transphobic. One eye roll worthy argument I remember TIFs making was "the creators of this college didn't mean to make a women's college, but a college for all oppressed genders!!11!! When this school was founded the oppressed gender was 'cis' women but now the oppressed genders include trans men!!111!!!"

Honestly, the narcissism of TIFs doing backflips to justify why we had to call them men at all times EXCEPT when they wanted to attend a women's college was what peaked me, as well as the narcissism of them willingly attending a women's college yet demanding everyone else change their language to suit them (for example, saying that calling our women's college a women's college was transphobic because it excluded them lmfao.)

[–]BEB 8 insightful - 4 fun8 insightful - 3 fun9 insightful - 4 fun -  (0 children)

They sound insufferable, but that seems to be a trait of trans activists in general.

[–]Panchino 5 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Because they get SUCH a boner

[–]Carthimundia 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Because ultimately the only consistent thing is they have to get what THEY want. There’s no logic here. They want to be men AND they want to go to an all women college. They want to opt out of womanhood and all the crap that goes along with it while still keeping any perks that being female brings. Also on a more cynical note, I worked at an all woman’s college and the TIFS were always incredibly popular and had loads of girlfriends. I think sex is probably quite a big motivating factor in some cases.

[–]BEB 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

When I was in school with lots of lesbians, these TiFs would have been proud butch dykes. And yes, some were extremely popular with lots of girlfriends.

How sad that butch dykes now feel that they have to be men and not proud, fierce wimmin.

[–]kalina 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Because they know on the inside that they are women.

[–]divingrightintowork 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They want to have their cake and eat it too, just like tws want to be in gay men's spaces and women's spaces.

[–]Carthimundia 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Because ultimately the only consistent thing is they have to get what THEY want. There’s no logic here. They want to be men AND they want to go to an all women college. They want to opt out of womanhood and all the crap that goes along with it while still keeping any perks that being female brings. Also on a more cynical note, I worked at an all woman’s college and the TIFS were always incredibly popular and had loads of girlfriends. I think sex is probably quite a big motivating factor in some cases.