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[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (10 children)

Have fun being in a world where you’ll get fired for expressing your bigotry in public and your friends and family consider you an embarrassment at dinner parties. And yeah I’ll be enjoying the use of my spaces thanks dude

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Lmao I’m overbooked and most people know I’m gc.

My family and friends all agree with me.

And I guess good for you that you’ll continue to make women and girls feel uncomfortable, that you’ll invade their spaces and strip them of their rights. I don’t know why you keep mentioning that, like we don’t already know you’re an invader lol

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (7 children)

Segregationists never win bro, regardless of what you’re bigoted family thinks. From a demographic perspective though I doubt they all agree with you sir

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 13 insightful - 1 fun13 insightful - 0 fun14 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

I don’t know why you think most people disagree with me, but go ahead and cling to that. You seem to need to.

And there’s a huge difference between sex based spaces and racial segregation. You may win for a short time, but you and a few other qt have shown me that in due time, you all expose yourselves as mentally unstable misogynists, so I’m sure more women will come to see you for what you really are, and we’ll take back our rights and spaces. Approval rates are dropping, “trans rights” are precarious atm. People are peaking allover- and it’s directly because of trans people themselves, you’re doing our work for us. Thanks

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Sex-segregation was done as inclusive measure - to include women into social life and sports. While race segregation was the opposite - to exclude black people from social life. Sex segregated sports and spaces are existing as inclusive measure.

And it is opposite even in classes of people - sex-segregation is needed for women, oppressed class. And men taking it away is oppressors taking away inclusion for women - or excluding women from social life and sports. So it is opposite to race segregation.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Thank you. I think it’s astonishing that they don’t understand the difference.

I get it if they were to say they know it’s a female space but they just feel safer invading it, but to act like we’re segregationists for wanting to maintain our rights is so misogynistic and insulting to poc who actually experienced segregation.

[–]MarkTwainiac 3 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 5 fun4 insightful - 6 fun -  (3 children)

Sex-segregation was done as inclusive measure - to include women into social life and sports. While race segregation was the opposite - to exclude black people from social life

Actually, sex-segregation was originally done as an exclusive measure - namely, to make & keep institutions and most of the public sphere for males only, and to keep girls & women confined mainly at home, in domestic work, in harems & brothels, or to their own section in synagogues, mosques and other houses of worship.

Sex-segregation was also instituted as a way of shaming, ostracizing or separating women from the rest of the world & normal life when undergoing specific processes of female biology - hence, menstrual huts, women being forbidden from cooking or preparing food when menstruating, and forcing women into long periods of "confinement" before & after giving birth.

In much of the world, sex segregation has been accomplished via laws and customs that kept women mostly at home, forbade them from attending school, restricted their access to transport, required them to be accompanied by male chaperones outside the home and to cover their heads and bodies whenever in public. Items of clothing like burquas and the head-to-toe chadors that girls & women in Iran were forced to wear after the 1979 Islamic revolution are basically portable cloth prisons meant to identify, stigmatize, segregate, isolate, physically discomfort and encumber girls & women as much as possible when outside the home.

As these examples illustrate, sex segregation be can be used as much to oppress as to help liberate women and insure our safety, dignity & privacy. Sex-segregation itself is not inherently a benefit or a drawback. Its impact varies depending on the specific reasoning behind it, circumstances surrounding it, & how it's implemented.

In the West, when schools, workplaces, major institutions & the public sphere gradually started opening up to girls & women, additional facilities for females like loos, waiting rooms and train cars were added to the already-existing ones long in use exclusively by males. But the reasoning when this happened wasn't always or necessarily to provide girls & women with safety, privacy, dignity and fairness - it was to keep girls & women out of the many male-only spaces that males wanted to remain male-only, such as the smoking & bar cars on trains, institutions of higher learning, certain professions, social clubs and entertainment venues.

Fact is, even after the world outside the home began to open up to girls & women, boys & men didn't want female people in their toilets, locker rooms, clubs, smoking lounges, sports venues, fraternities, grills, saloons, pool halls etc except as servers, cleaners, cooks and when working in some capacity to entertain and sexually service men.

Over time, women realized and articulated all the various ways that certain kinds of sex-segregated spaces in specific circumstances can and do benefit girls & women. As a result, over time women lobbied for & built a lot of female-only spaces - ranging from women's only schools & universities, women's loos & lounges, women's social clubs, women's hospital wards & entire hospitals, women's organizations, and in the 1960s & 70s, rape refuges and shelters for women escaping male domestic violence.

But when sex-segregation originated, & through much of its history even in the contemporary era, it was put into place & maintained because it's what men & boys wanted.

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Actually, sex-segregation was originally done as an exclusive measure - namely, to make & keep institutions and most of the public sphere for males only, and to keep girls & women confined mainly at home, in domestic work, in harems & brothels, or to their own section in synagogues, mosques and other houses of worship.

That is not "male and female bathrooms", that is "male bathrooms and no other ones". Which is not really what is meant when talking about sex-segregation. And taking away female-only spaces is returning to that version of "sex-segregation" that you are talking about, but now with "male spaces and everyone else's spaces which is dangerous to marginalized groups".

I understand that technically "males were allowed to have their own spaces and females weren't allowed to have their own spaces" - is technically sex segregation too, but it is pretty pedantic view and not the point of discussion.

[–]MarkTwainiac 2 insightful - 7 fun2 insightful - 6 fun3 insightful - 7 fun -  (1 child)

Sorry, but even today there is still a lot of sex segregation in the world that's meant to exclude & restrict girls & women & does just that. It's only in certain narrow circumstances and for specific reasons that sex-segregation facilitates female people's full inclusion/participation in society rather than our oppression.

I understand that technically "males were allowed to have their own spaces and females weren't allowed to have their own spaces"

That's not what I meant. It wasn't that males had their own spaces & females weren't allowed to have their own spaces. It's that pretty much the whole world both at home & outside it was the domain of males, whilst females were confined to very narrow areas - the domestic sphere, harems, brothels, nunneries & a few jobs outside the home (cleaners, servers, cooks, laundresses, nurses).

Females for millennia have had our own spaces, but mostly not by choice, and usually not in a way that fostered either inclusion in society or which led to liberation rather than oppression.

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You are taking "sex-segregation" as very-very broad idea, and mostly speaking about something that can be described as "gender" - what women allowed to do and where women allowed to be. Again, technically it is sex-segregation, but it is way too broad meaning. Same way majority of asians living in Asia will be a race segregation too, but obviously it is not what we are speaking about when speaking about racism and race segregation.

What we are speaking is about public life - race segregation in view of "toilets only for black and only for white" and "tilets only for women and only for men", and same with sports. Sex-segregation in this case was restricting black people from public life, while for women it is the opposite - it is including women in public life. And unisex toilets or "only male" toilets would exclude women from public life (with only unisex toilets we can see issues in countries like Kenya, where girls and teen girls are skipping classes during menstruation, skipping a lot of education, or holding pee until lessons ended, while worsening their health by doing that), and in sports sex-segregation gave women ability to fairly and equally compete, it protects women from extra injuries in contact sports and so on.

While sex-segregation in very broad term is a completely different issue, with which feminists all over the world are fighting. And in places with sex-segregation we are speaking about in our posts (as this whole discussion was about them, before you arrived) - feminists are fighting to have those spaces be for women-only and not be taken away.

[–]just_lesbian_things 11 insightful - 1 fun11 insightful - 0 fun12 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Have fun being in a world where you’ll get fired for expressing your bigotry in public and your friends and family consider you an embarrassment at dinner parties.

Sounds word for word what homophobes, racists, and misogynists have said to me to try and shame/intimiate me into falling in line with the status quo.