Did feminism cause the current state of transgender politics?

submitted by Kotal from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]cybitch 6 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 3 fun -  (9 children)

These points that you've brought out is why a lot of women don't call themselves feminists, myself included. It's funny, I'm about as pro-women's rights as they come, my interests lie in traditionally masculine fields so sexism will be a bigger issue for me in my career than it would be for most women. However, I also can't stand by nonsense like word policing and the denial that women and men have different brains and a different temperament. In fact, I see biological differences as the number one cause of both the patriarchy and whatever it is this sub considers the correct word for the sex changer people. For a woman's offspring to survive in nature, she has to avoid getting into any sort of conflicts, not just in the sense of not harming herself physically, but also because pregnancy is a dangerous time and she will need support from others. Women can't afford to settle things with open conflict like men, so appeasement and using language is all women have. Now it's being used against us and quite frankly I find men being so openly gleeful about it to be a bit sickening. I loathe western feminism as well, but I also see why it is what it is, and it's at least partially the fault of evolution.

[–]lairacunda 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Men and women don't "have different brains". Humans have brain plasticity and brains develop in accordance to experience and environment. Blue-boy-brains/pink-girl-brains is part of the trans agenda.

What are you doing here if you "loathe feminism"?

[–]cybitch 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Yes, men and women do have biologically different brains. There's a LOT of info about this online, please educate yourself. Humans are animals, and like other animals, we are born with certain instinctive behaviors.

I'm here because I don't buy into trans delusions. Also, I want to fight for women's rights, but I am not a feminist because there is no subset of feminism that fits with my worldview. It's unfortunate modern feminism can't be for all women, but that's what thought policing does to a movement.

[–]lairacunda 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Educate your own self.

https://sexnotgender.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/fine_cordelia_delusions-of-gender.pdf

https://www.academia.edu/39501028/Testosterone_Rex_Myths_of_Sex_Science_and_Society_by_Cordelia_Fine

EDIT: I didn't say there are no differences between men and women. If that were the case TWs wouldn't be such a problem, right? My point is that the pink brain/blue brain framework is a genderist myth.

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

From what I've read, the evidence for biologically different brains is ambiguous. I'm only going on Cordelia Fine's 'Delusions of Gender' and 'Testosterone Rex', I haven't read anything peer reviewed or anything. They are worth a look, if you're interested in that field

[–]worried19 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Where's u/thrwpllw, is she here yet?

She was the go-to person for brain studies on Reddit. I think she's a neuroscientist.

[–]cybitch 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

For me the question is what exactly the differences imply, or don't imply. Some women seem to believe that a biological difference would somehow mean women do not deserve to have equal rights and opportunities. Different doesn't mean inferior, even if that's what men have been telling us. Women are an essential, needed part of human society just as much as men are either way. There's no need to deny science in order to demand better treatment for us. There's no need to believe any theory about anything in order to believe women's rights are important. Women who claim to be feminist shouldn't try to police what other women believe. We're on the same side about the things that matter.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yeah that's true. I just found it interesting that the science of our biological differences is ambiguous.

[–]roguecanine 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

For a woman's offspring to survive in nature, she has to avoid getting into any sort of conflicts, not just in the sense of not harming herself physically, but also because pregnancy is a dangerous time and she will need support from others. Women can't afford to settle things with open conflict like men, so appeasement and using language is all women have.

I would be careful with this whole evolutionary biology thing. Women and men are not different species and we are more the same than we are different. Evolution wouldn't go out of its way to create different brains if merely enhancing aggression via testosterone in men would have sufficed. It's hard to make any claims about women's propensity or lack of thereof to engage in conflicts because of the ever present socialization women have to go through. When society puts you down for the slightest hint of aggression it's no wonder you would be forced to develop other means through which to channel aggression. When it's OK for boys to get into fist fights, for girls it's blasphemy. Assertiveness in women is considered bitchiness, while it's congratulated in men. And when it comes to adults - is it any surprise that the physically weaker sex would try to solve conflicts with words vs fists - after all, they know they won't win the fist fight. It looks like a logical response to me, not related to one's sex - men would have had the same attitude when faced with physically stronger opponents.