Mod abuse? I was banned from s/IdeasForSaidIt, though I did not break rules, whereas I responded to a person who could only make personal attacks, and is a mod

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[–]AXXA 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (36 children)

I was actually on your side until you wrote that comment. I had upvoted your post too but I took my vote back because of it. Forget about legalistic interpretations of the PoD and just try being nice to people.

For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Matthew-Chapter-5/

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (30 children)

A double-standard. Normal visitors face personal attacks from Saiditors constantly, and when there is a normal person response to the abusive Saiditors, mods are critical of the normal folks, without having any interest in the torrent of abuses - mainly personal insults - from a handful of bad faith mentally ill assholes. You, AXXA, are one of the people my question is directed to, because you - I thought - understood the problems. A potential solution is to use the Bible for guidance and focus on the sin, rather than the sinner (that mods address personal insults, but not criticisms of comments). This I think is a way forward, and yet I see that no one seems to understand this or care about it, or both. Saidit won't grow because of it.

[–]AXXA 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

Are you completely unaware of the double-standard here?

But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Matthew-Chapter-5/

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Nice - but out of context. Jesus, the Buddha, Zoroaster, God and others clarify that:

You have every right to defend yourself from the attacks of others, even if that defense is with the use of force to repel the other.

You do NOT have the right to attack others. (This is allowed at Saidit, but only for some.)

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (27 children)

Sins:

  1. ban evasion
  2. downward hypocrisy
  3. downward lying
  4. downward sealioning
  5. downward shilling
  6. supporting economic tyranny
  7. supporting government tyranny
  8. supporting media tyranny
  9. supporting medical tyranny
  10. supporting totalitarian (commie + fascist) tyranny

I could go on.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (26 children)

...with more insane comments...

[–]AXXA[A] 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (24 children)

/u/socks do not name call.

/s/SaidIt/comments/j1/the_saiditnet_terms_and_content_policy/

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (23 children)

There it is. I refer to insane comments. I did not call anyone a name. THIS is what Saidit can allow.

[–]AXXA 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (20 children)

You are on notice that Saidit does not allow this. I have now added your warning to your account notes. Both /u/AmericanMuskrat and I favored a temporary ban for you because we value your contributions to Saidit. I favored a two week ban hoping that you would use the time to take the PoD to heart but instead your intransigence led you to evade the ban. I continue to otherwise value your contributions to Saidit but am now reconsidering whether a temporary ban can bring any change to your intransigence.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (19 children)

Is it possible that you are wrong about this? As I've said: mods do nothing about users who post personal attacks against some of the users - while telling me that a reference to "insane comments" breaks the rules.

Are you telling me that it is against Saidit rules to tell someone that their comments are insane?

Can you confirm that you will ban someone who refers to the 'comments' in a post as 'insane'? (eg. let's say I do this 2 more times, and you use the same argument)

If so, I hope you and others will appreciate that this would be an example of how to ban everyone on Saidit.

Again, this is not really about me, but mod abuse, and - AXXA - this is what has happened in your current response.

And you can consider me bonkers or whatever, but see the chat here, with d3rr, were I ask about this kind of issue.

(He notes that it's fair to criticise comments.) But let's look at the bigger picture of mod abuse - which I am angry about at the moment because I've experienced it for the past 15 months. I know that others often don't agree with me on right-wing Saidit, but that's what I've been curious about - how to discuss anything with these people. Of course there are some who are unable to hold a conversation, and I try to avoid them. But I am sick of the terrible approaches to moderating, which are unfairly managed.

So - if you are a Christian and you are interested in the improvement of Saidit - think about this and Saidit's reputation. As for my username, I wanted to keep it in order to continue the /s/shitpostnews sub, but perhaps that can remain as is for now. If the username is banned, Saiditors and Redditors will see an example of mod abuse, where one's disagreement or criticism of a comment is censored on Saidit, especially if it's not fascist. It will be an interesting reference point for occasional comments in the future about the way in which Saidit is supposed to be a Reddit alternative, until I point out this example of a ban that it's not any different from Reddit, or any other alternative social media website, albeit the smallest of them because of abusive users the mods won't deal with.

[–]AXXA 6 insightful - 6 fun6 insightful - 5 fun7 insightful - 6 fun -  (16 children)

If the username is banned

Your concern trolling about Saidit while stating your intention to ban evade proves to me that Jason's decision to ban you is correct. That's actually quite an accomplishment which makes me wonder what your true game really is. If you're trying to get banned so you can prove some kind of point then I'm willing to accommodate you. We can play whatever game you want to play.

CC /u/d3rr

[–]JasonCarswell 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Jason's decision to ban

IFIFY:
Jason's proposal to the community for banishment

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

AXXA - WTF - I did NOT state an: "intention to ban evade"

As for the grand plan - I only comment on occasional posts, and normally don't have much to say, unless of course I am being attacked, which happened recently. This of course brought to mind my comments on problems of users being attacked. The only recourse in that case is to respond to the comment (rather than respond to the user with a similar attack). Falling for the trap (and this is an OLD series of attempts) to respond in kind to the personal attacks with one personal attack from me - even after getting 30 personal attacks - will get me banned, but not the attacker banned. Users on Reddit and here have had the the right to disagree and say bad things about a person's comment. That's not a bannable offense. If you make it a bannable offense, users on Saidit will be unable to disagree with a comment without wondering if they'd be banned for a strong disagreement. It's that simple. Why do I have to explain this, I wonder. And - there is certainly no benefit for anyone to play whatever game you mention, and especially not to spend 15 months doing it, especially on Saidit (where there wouldn't be much of an impact). In Saiidit's early days there were problems with attacks, but those were entirely different. I hope this is a helpful explanation.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

No I was noting your interpretation was valid, not that it's fair to insult someone's writing however you see fit. Also it's polite to let someone know that you are screenshotting their chat comments.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

In afterthought - I could have included /u/d3rr after that - I agree. I tend not to do this because the response is often - 'please don't page me...'.

There are many ways one can see a response to his/her comment as an insult - and if this is not allowed on Saidit (whereas it's allowed on other sites) - it will be impossible to monitor properly.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It might not be Ad Hominem, but it is at best a Tone Response. You did not address any of the argument.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm arguing in my many responses to people these past 2 days that the roles of mods can be simplified to focusing only on the bottom two lines of the POD (ad hominim and name calling) and can overlook lines above those two. Most social sites allow negative or insulting responses to comments. Limiting those kinds of negative responses to comments (not users) at Saidit is pissing everyone off, and costing mods a lot of time. Nor is it necessary. Nor is this applied evenly to everyone. So rather than continue with the mod abuse (where mods unfairly criticize negative responses to comments, while letting their favorite users constantly abuse other users with personal attacks), prioritize the bottom two lines of the POD for moderation, and forget about the upper portion of the POD, as already happens with some mods - when supporting their favorite users and attacking their least favorite users.

Edit: my comment: 'insane comments' relates to the same comment in much longer responses in the previous post, which I link in the original post, so it's a continued response to the same discussion which does have the evidence listed. That said - outside of its context - as a single response, it can be called a tone response. DAR LOVES to use this excuse to censor discussion. But it can be applied to literally everything.

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

...with more insane comments...

Makes no sense. If you're going to break Saidit rules, try to avoid word salads.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (4 children)

Good commandments, ahead of this quotation in Matthew 5:3-19, some of which I should quote here, but directly to my point about one's comment/'sin', rather than the 'sinner' - so to speak - Ezekial 33:11 is a helpful source:

Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

[–]JasonCarswell 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

Ezekial 33:11 is a helpful source: Say unto them, As I live, saith the Lord God, I have no pleasure in the death of the wicked; but that the wicked turn from his way and live: turn ye, turn ye from your evil ways; for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

Indeed socks, so smarten up, repent your idolatry of authoritarianism, worshiping the proven liar media, proven corrupt mafia governments, and proven harmful big pharma - and stop sealioning, stop shilling, stop lying, stop defending those corrupt with power, and wake up. That's simply all I've ever wanted of you - or keep your evil ways and just leave SaidIt.

Sooner or later the paradigm shift will happen. Either you can shift yourself, or you will be shifted. These are often unpleasant, but after the strain the former is empowering, while the later you've learned nothing.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

You're blocked - so you won't get replies - except for this one - which is that you've definitely misinterpreted Ezekial

[–]JasonCarswell 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

You're blocked - so you won't get replies - except for this one - which is that you've definitely misinterpreted Ezekial

socks has finally blocked me, allegedly. Ping /u/d3rr.

It's sad that he won't see me point out that I did not interpret nor misinterpret Ezekial, and he seems adamant to remain intentionally "ignorant" and in denial of his support for authoritarian evil. Bad faith gonna bad faith.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

praise be!