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[–]notafed 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

The process is the punishment. Even if the prosecution loses, their win is to blacken Trump's reputation and tie up his time and resources defending himself.

[–]twolanterns 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

perversion of justice by these abusers may be the thing that brings the revolt of the sane

clock ticks closer to midnight

[–]passionflounderIndependent 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

If the judicial system is sufficiently corrupted then the facts will not matter. As it currently stands, "justice" is nothing more than a political weapon where the targeted political opposition faces prison time for simply being the opposition.

[–]Dune1032 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The evidence supports the indictment. From https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2023/aug/02/donald-trump-indictment-pages-jack-smith-january-6-election-2020

“These claims were false, and the Defendant knew that they were false,” the document reads. It goes on to list the many people and institutions that directly informed Trump that there was no evidence of fraud, from Vice-President Mike Pence down.

Familiar though they are, some of the details remain just too delicious for Smith – and by extension the Guardian – not to recount. He recalls that during the notorious call between Trump and Georgia’s secretary of state, Brad Raffensperger, in which the president asked him to “find” 11,780 votes, the defendant also claimed that 5,000 dead people had voted.

“The actual number were two,” Raffensperger replied. “Two. Two people that were dead that voted.”

The indictment largely follows the roadmap set out by the January 6 committee in its relatively elephantine 845-page final report. It traces the story of the fake electors who were convened in key battleground states lost by Trump in an effort to send illegal false electoral certificates to Congress.

Smith emphasises the extraordinary lengths to which Trump and his co-conspirators went, filing a petition to the US supreme court from Arizona on 11 December 2020 “as a pretext to claim that litigation was pending in the state”. Giuliani was concerned, the indictment alleges using his “Co-Conspirator 1” moniker, that it “could appear treasonous for the AZ electors to vote if there is no pending court proceeding”.

Sure enough, all 16 fake electors in Michigan have now been charged by the state attorney general, and further criminal counts are expected soon against some of the fake electors in Georgia.

[–]iamonlyoneman[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

OMG people are STILL taking "find" out of context.

Oh wait I forgot

orangemanbad.

[–]EthnocratIndependent 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Zion Don!

[–]SoCo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why would a state who had found 6000+ missing ballots in recent recounts....ever be asked if he can find 11,780 more?

Without projected nefarious motivations (ie gaslighting), this is an absolutely normal thing to ask. How I would have put it: "Bitch, your broken ass state's system lost a crap-ton of damn ballots and is ruining the whole election. Do your job and go make sure damn you bumbling fools didn't lose more!"

Georgia's known for different, last minute, more-forgiving and extra ballot curing rules in Democrat-held urban counties, violating equal protection laws, and creating a persistent pattern of psudo-'gerrymandering' of ballot rules. This persistent fuckery every damn election has had them on my shit-list for a long time. The Supreme Court ruling on this literally gave Bush the 2000 election against Al Gore, as hanging chads were not permitted to be hand counted in one county but not all of Florida, despite the machine counting being inaccurate.

They had a ton of people who were over 115 years old that recorded votes in various states, so thinking dead people may have voted seems reasonable. They later found that various states had terrible record keeping, many errors, and terribly designed databases that defaulted to very non standard "filler" dates to represent that the date of birth was unknown, such as Jan 1st 1900, 1850, and 1800.

Many of these states also mailed mail-in-ballots to many dead people, as well as an extreme amount to people who's voter registrations hadn't been updated in 15+ years, giving a reasonable concern that others could intercept and abuse those carelessly distributed mail-in-ballots.

Smith speculates that random lawyers, some aligned with trump loosely and some not at all may have filed a petition to the US supreme court from Arizona on 11 December 2020 “as a pretext to claim that litigation was pending in the state”. Projecting that Giuliani was concerned about doing it properly.

It seems telling that Smith must merge all these independent people together into one, then projects a coordinated nefarious motivation on the group as a whole, to sell this gaslighted conspiracy.

Obviously, no one wants their legal efforts to correct and uncover election misdeeds to wrongly appear unsavory. Everyone knows to accomplish corrections in broken elections, you must have alternative electors ready. They also know your political opponents will always try trick the public into thinking your alternative electors are some nefarious fake electors.

These inner-decision making dialogs, being abused out of context like this, is one large reason why client-attorney correspondence and discussion is normally highly protected and not normally used as a basis for charges.

On the deadline, December 14, 2020, 16 Republican candidates signed certificates that identified these alternative ("contingent") electors as Georgia's "duly elected and qualified" electors. This makes descriptions of them as "Fake electors" factually incorrect.

The "contingent" electors were a normal and proper procedure with strong precedence from the 1960 Hawaii Nixon election, where 3 slates of "dueling" electors were submitted due to ongoing litigation.

"And far from rebuking them for misrepresenting their status on December 19, "Judge Jamieson hailed them as heroes, describing their meeting as a critically important step that preserved their ability for their presidential ballots to be counted after the Democrats prevailed in their election contest and the Governor certified the Democratic contingent presidential electors as having been elected."

...as Lawyer contingent Republican presidential elector, Brad Carver, argued at his Georgia State Bar complaint. Both lawyers who participated as contingent Republican presidential electors, Brad Carver and Daryl Moody, had their complaints dismissed as unsubstantiated by the State Disciplinary Board who "reviewed the conduct of the contingent Republican presidential electors."