What Will NATO Do About Ukraine? - A Son of the New American Revolution

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[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

The NATO Summit in Vilnius is one week away and the situation in Ukraine grows worse with each passing day. One indicator that things are grim is the confirmation today, by the usually effervescent Volodymyr Zelensky, that Russia launched a successful strike on the Ukrainian Intelligence Service (SBU) headquarters in Sumy.

NATO is no longer unified. Several European leaders are noting quietly that Europe cannot prosper without a relationship with Russia. In other words, isolating and shunning Moscow is no longer seen as a viable strategy. Latvia, albeit an insignificant military power, announced a change in its policy of issuing visas

The dilemma NATO faces is figuring out how to extract itself from the war in Ukraine without destroying itself. I do not see a solution and welcome your insights on that question.

[–]MeganDelacroix🤡🌎 detainee 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Macgregor's been saying for a while now that he doesn't think NATO survives this decade. It's tough to imagine, but less so with each passing day.

[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

I've heard the same prediction about the EU. And it does seem extreme but it's also understandable for many reasons. The populations of the member states, particularly of NATO, are starting to demand it and there were already fractures between member states because the pressure to conform to the leaderships' diktats weighs differentially on the various members. The EU in particular but also NATO, both headquartered in Brussels as I understand, have accrued more power to themselves since the Ukraine war began and are making demands on member states that fall outside the charters they originally signed up for.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

The populations of the member states, particularly of NATO, are starting to demand it [the dissolution of the EU] and there were already fractures between member states because the pressure to conform to the leaderships' diktats weighs differentially on the various members.

There could be the old Jeffersonian Solution*, that was never done in the US.

Keep the framework of the Union (because it has some good points in concept) but write up a new contract to fix the problems inherent in the old contract.

Edit: Side Note -- if the theoretical "new contract" was acceptable enough, England might go back in.

*Jefferson apparently thought the 1787 Constitution would only last about twenty years and would then be replaced.

[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Well, the EU could just pull its tentacles back and play the limited role it was originally stated to be. As for NATO, it was a defensive alliance which needed to be scrapped when the core reason for its existence - the Soviet Union - dissolved, in favor of a Eurasian security agreement that all countries in that region, including Russia and the other former SSRs, had a say in. That's what you do when you're actually interested in peace and stability versus planting the seeds for future conflict. And it isn't as though there wasn't plenty of historical precedent for these types of agreements in that exact region.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Well, the EU could just pull its tentacles back and play the limited role it was originally stated to be.

It could be considered that the EU's ability to do what it's doing now is "a flaw in the original contract."

If it simply stopped what it's doing now, it would still have the ability to do it again, later.

[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Which would be grounds for the other parties to pull out of the contract without penalty.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Like England did?

[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

They did but not on those grounds. And for all intents and purposes the UK government is totally ignoring the Brexit results.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

"You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave."