Dr. Will Powers Endorses the Existence of Autogynephilia on Reddit and then Walks it Back After AGPs Tell Him Tales of "Gender Euphoria"

submitted by yousaythosethings from (self.GenderCritical)

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[–]Fusrodamus 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I don't think he caved to mob pressure. He's just heard some things that have made him question his views. Nothing wrong with that. I just hope he reaches the correct conclusion as to where his error lies.

I believe his understanding of autogynephilia is flawed. In one comment he states:

It wouldn't be AGP in that case, it would be gender euphoria. Basically, the patient would experience joy and pleasure in non-sexual ways from expressing a feminine gender identity.

For AGP, it HAS to be sexual only. That's it, outside the sexual aspects, its no longer a desire for the patient.

For a transgender person, envisioning themselves being sexual as their preferred gender would be normal. They just also would envision themselves eating icecream as that gender, working as that gender, seeing a movie as that gender. For AGP they come into the exam room and the whole encounter revolves around their sex life.

I think this is why he underestimates the number of AGPs he sees. He sees the possibility of gender euphoria being non-sexual. And he misses the possibility that an AGP would derive sexual pleasure from engaging in non-sexual activities "as a woman." For an AGP, there's nothing about his idea of being a woman that's non-sexual.

[–]Cicerosolo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

I like what you're saying and I thank you for it. However, I've seen Blanchard make statements on twitter that many agp feelings go beyond sexual and really do feel euphoric and lack that sexual feeling on many instances. Of course, sex is the foundation but we need to also speak of the euphoric validation or we let these fools more readily dismiss Blanchard's theory. In my view at least

[–]Fusrodamus 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

I have trouble with the idea that gender euphoria can be non-sexual. I think my first hurdle is accepting that just because a lot of guys use "gender euphoria" as a euphemism for "erection" doesn't necessarily mean that's the case for everyone.

I'm having difficulty imagining what gender euphoria looks like in the absence of a sexual motivation. What is it about appearing, behaving, or being treated like the opposite sex that triggers joy?

I might just be jaded because I've seen far too many men attempt to justify their fetish-induced arousal as something more profound.

[–]Cicerosolo 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Great response. The issue is that men's sexuality is fundamentally different to a woman's so it's difficult to internalise it. Many many men do use euphoria sexually because they want to avoid the appearance of agp (even unwittingly) but if you sift through you find the non sexual identity ones. I think best words for it are validated, right, correct, normal. It kind of makes sense though, like to transition you need a lot of incentive, sometimes beyond sex

[–]jet199 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Even the ones which seem non-sexual are sexual.

AGP will get a hard on imagining they are a girl waiting for a bus or a woman shopping for tampons. They turn complex non-sexual things into sexual.

These guys aren't getting euphoria because they feel normal. No one does that. That's just the PR version.

Words like validation, affirmation, etc are just cover for them getting off on the acceptance they have forced others to have of fantasy sex toy woman they have built in their heads.

[–]MarkTwainiac 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

What jet199 said 1000%!

[–]yousaythosethings[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

This is the correct response. I think sometimes their euphoria might seem "non-sexual" because for some of them, their sexuality is driven entirely inward. As in they stop have sexual feelings and desire outside of themselves and may start identifying as "asexual." But the feelings are sexual nonetheless. Copying for context, the four categories of sexual fantasy associated with autogynephilia:

  • Transvestic autogynephilia: arousal to the act or fantasy of wearing typically feminine clothing

  • Behavioral autogynephilia: arousal to the act or fantasy of doing something regarded as feminine

  • Physiologic autogynephilia: arousal to fantasies of body functions specific to people regarded as female

  • Anatomic autogynephilia: arousal to the fantasy of having a normative woman's body, or parts of one

Hence, behavioral autogynephilia allows them to sexualize an entirely non-sexual experience like shopping for tampons or using a woman's bathroom. Euphoria = Boners. Always.

[–]Cicerosolo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Check Blanchard's Twitter, my read of his stuff is he doesn't agree

[–]Cicerosolo 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Check Blanchard's Twitter, my read of his stuff is he doesn't agree. Maybe it's safe to say 100% of agps experience the sexual thrill of imagining they're a woman but only 75% of the time (just spit balling here) and the other 25% are those euphoria validation feelings

[–]MarkTwainiac 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes indeed

men's sexuality is fundamentally different to a woman's

and to women's sexuality more generally.

But what you've said does not make the case at all for the claim that the "gender euphoria" of male cross-dressers and/or those who claim to have an opposite sex "gender identity" is sometimes or ever non-sexual.

Even you say that for these men

Of course, sex is the foundation

So how is it that at the same time the "gender euphoria" these very same men feel is

sometimes beyond sex

????