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transmed vs GC debates issues

submitted by pippiTheLongstocki from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]loveSloaneDebate King 14 insightful - 1 fun14 insightful - 0 fun15 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

It was a little hard to follow, but this is what stuck out to me:

“But also I found it's very difficult to debate GC beeing transmed“

I feel like transmed thinks that because they aren’t as extreme or as unreasonable as qt, that gc should see them as the “right kind” of trans and be willing to compromise with them. Women shouldn’t have to compromise on their rights, spaces, or what it means to be a woman just because you aren’t as annoying and are slightly more rational.

“The problem is that GC is not used to know transmed position.“

We (or at least I and the other gc here) know it, that doesn’t mean we agree with it.

“We, transmed, usually claim that transition is proper treatment for truscam transgenders, and not healing gender dysphoria leads to commit to suicide.”

Why don’t suicide rates drop post transition? I don’t care what adults do to their bodies, so if transition helps adults, do whatever you want. I care that trans people seem to think that those of us who aren’t trans are obligated to participate in their transition. Take all the hormones you want, get all the surgeries you want, change your name, wear what you want- just don’t demand that I call a male a woman or a female a man, and leave my rights, spaces, and sports alone. If you can’t do those things, what does it matter that you’re transmed? You’re still causing and contributing to the same issues for women that qt causes.

“no hormonal blockers for teens, even if gender dysphoria was proper diagnosted”

They aren’t adults. They can’t give consent. Someone else already addressed this, so I’ll just say I agree with them.

“change gender markers in the ID cards back to sex at the birth”

You can’t change sex. Gender is a social construct, society doesn’t see you as the sex/gender you wish you were, so there’s no justification for lying on legal documents. If you want to end up in a hospital and receive improper treatment because you chose to lie on legal documents, at this point I feel like that’s on you and idgaf, but that puts the doctors who treat you and the hospital at risk if something goes wrong- that’s unfair.

“It could lead for millions of deaths.”

So could lying on legal documents. But also- gc isn’t forcing suicide on you, nor are we murdering you or encouraging others to murder you. We are not directly or indirectly responsible for the lives (or deaths) of trans people. Various mental illnesses are rampant in the trans community, even post transition there’s a high level of suicide. And trans people aren’t getting killed anywhere near the same rate as other demographics, even taking into consideration how low the trans population is.

“ like adding in goverment-issued ID sex at the birth and leave a gender marker,”

I would never suggest this. Male is male. Female is female. Deal with it imo

“but it could not work if you're truscam, and transitioned because of gender dysphoria”

  1. Lol at the “scam” part being a typo but also accurate

  2. So it doesn’t work because of the mental illness you have that isn’t effectively being treated?

“especially if you're stealth - you do not disclose your past. Rumors are fast, and implementing this suggestion simply destroy millions of life.”

In other words “being honest with other people would ruin my life so I’d rather you agree to make it even easier for me to lie”

It’s not your past. It’s your present reality. It wouldn’t be a rumor, it would be true.

“So, highlighting this issue different ways, including way to compare this approach to Yellow-star on jew in Nazi state, I was banned several times“

Probably because you advocate for letting people lie on legal documents and not disclose information that would matter to some people (idk how hard you stealth, but if you’re not telling sexual partners you’re a rapist in my eyes), but then have the audacity to compare it to the Holocaust. I don’t understand why trans people constantly compare themselves to groups of people who have endured suffering they won’t ever come close to. It’s probably due to a lack of self awareness and narcissistic self importance.

“I was banned several times. Looks like it's very difficult to share opinion, if it's so trigger GC.“

I think perhaps it’s you that gets triggered. GC lives in the real world and wants to keep things honest and fair to females. You want us to make it easier for you to undermine our rights and for you to lie to others.

[–]pippiTheLongstocki[S] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (3 children)

Why don’t suicide rates drop post transition?

It's not true. This is meta research: https://whatweknow.inequality.cornell.edu/topics/lgbt-equality/what-does-the-scholarly-research-say-about-the-well-being-of-transgender-people/

You can’t change sex. Gender is a social construct, society doesn’t see you as the sex/gender you wish you were, so there’s no justification for lying on legal documents.

Gender is bio-social constract, we can have additional discussion about this topic

so there’s no justification for lying on legal documents

"you have no justification to lying on legal documents, everybody should to know, that you're jew". And having female look and male sex in the ID, it's like beeing clown and freak. Like not other people. You force split us into another group, like jew was forced to splitted to another group in the nazi state. Don't do this. I don't ask to move you into ghetto, why you want to do it with me? Are you really believe, that it make you life better?

It’s not your past. It’s your present reality. It wouldn’t be a rumor, it would be true.

What are you talking about? I integrated in the society as female. And nobody knows. Why do you want to destroy my life? What is it? Lack of empathy? Or maybe you're just hate group - what are you trying to deny?

think perhaps it’s you that gets triggered.

No, GC was triggered. Nobody wants to feel triggered massacre. 3rd Reich citizens didn't know - mostly - about gas cameras. So, you're trying to ignore fact what happen with us if you enforce what you want ignoring our lifes and vital interests

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

  1. Where does it get into suicide rates? Can you copy and paste it because that’s a lot to read and it kind of sounds like bullshit

  2. Gender is a social construct. Meaning society reinforces it. Society as a whole don’t see transwomen as women or transmen as men. Even if they did, transwomen aren’t women and transmen aren’t men. If you are a male who has legal documents stating you are female, you have lied on those legal documents. It’s that simple. If transwomen were female, they wouldn’t be transwomen.

  3. I don’t “force split you” into other groups. YOU ARE NOT A PART OF MY GROUP. You force entry into groups that you don’t belong in. You force entry into spaces you don’t belong in. Stop blaming women for being women and not wanting to share spaces or even their very sex/gender with their oppressors. And stop comparing yourself to Holocaust victims. You are not a female. You are not a woman. You are not the victim, the women and girls whose spaces, rights, and language you colonize are the victims. Fucking stop.

  4. You are not a woman. You are not a female. What is so hard to understand? Why should women be okay with making it easier for males to LARP as us? You clearly don’t seem to understand the concept of females wanting their own spaces or having boundaries, and that’s exactly one of the reasons why we don’t want you in our spaces pretending to be us.

  5. Nobody is sending you to a gas chamber. This comparison is so fucking disgusting. You are the one ignoring facts. I don’t have to care about your interests or your life, I’m not invading your space. I’m not lying about my sex, I’m not actively deceiving people, I’m not stripping away the rights and safety of 50% of the population then blaming them for my struggles while I shit on their rights. You are the one doing those things. The fact that you have the nerve to compare yourself to Holocaust victims as you do all of those things is fucking sick.

[–]a_green_squidtransmed i guess? 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (1 child)

Where does it get into suicide rates? Can you copy and paste it because that’s a lot to read and it kind of sounds like bullshit

It's literally the second study linked. https://www.emerald.com/insight/content/doi/10.1108/MHRJ-05-2014-0015/full/html

We are not directly or indirectly responsible for the lives (or deaths) of trans people. -(from your prior post)

Radfems advocating for the inability to access medical care (in some cases trying to block it until 25) makes them responsible. I don't care about how you FEEL it makes you heroes for increasing suicide rates, it objectively increases them.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King 8 insightful - 2 fun8 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I didn’t say shit about someone being 25. I said they should be adults. And nobody is responsible for suicide other than the person committing it.