QT: questions about transphobia (But gc feel free to add questions)

submitted by loveSloaneDebate King from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]loveSloaneDebate King[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I’m not implying that at all, that’s why I clarified what I was saying yesterday. I’m implying that a heterosexual man would not want date transwomen. Not even implying, straight up saying it.

But why is someone specifically attracted to TW a bad thing? That doesn’t mean they fetishize you, just as me being attracted to men and women doesn’t mean I fetishize either sex. And would that mean that trans people fetishize their non trans partners?

[–]peakingatthemomentTranssexual (natal male), HSTS 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I feel like specific attraction to transwomen is a fetish because 1) I’ve met those men, and 2) it’s not like an actual sex, it’s a mix of characteristics. GAMPs want a woman with a penis. To me, that is a fetish. It doesn’t work if you are gender dysphoric at all because, you don’t want that or want other people to think about you having it and are saving all your money for surgery.

I understand how due to the people involved dating men can’t be heterosexual technically, but at the same time, I feel like straight guys are sexually kind of shallow. My experience has taught me that most won’t lose attraction to you or not want to have sex with you because of something totally abstract like being trans if your body is like they expected. Maybe we’re just way off on how many guys are bi?

[–]loveSloaneDebate King[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I totally get why it wouldn’t work for a trans person, I get how it could trigger dysphoria, I just don’t know if it’s always fetishizing. It could be other reasons, some not much better than fetishizing, but again I’m not trans and I’m not attracted to trans people so I’m just speculating. I just think it’s odd that trans people can be attracted to non trans people, can even only want to date people who aren’t trans, and that’s not a fetish, but if someone is attracted to trans people specifically, they’re a fetishist. Idk. It’s not my place to really speak on it, I was just pondering through the keyboard. I guess I think it could be a fetish, and maybe even most often is, but I don’t think it is always.

[–]peakingatthemomentTranssexual (natal male), HSTS 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I just don’t see how it’s a type of attraction in humans could have evolved. Women with penises don’t exist naturally and couldn’t exist with exogenous hormone treatments (using women very loosely here, obviously not literally). It’s something that’s artificial. To me, that indicates a fetish.

Maybe there is a man who is attracted specifically to pre-op transwomen where it’s not a fetish, but I’ve never met one or heard of anyone else who has.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

It’s the equivalent of being attracted to someone for their amputation or because they are paralyzed. If someone were attracted to me as a woman great. If someone were attracted to me as a guy, insulting and I don’t understand how but still not that wild. But being attracted to someone because they are trans is necessarily fetishizing our traumatic history.

Edit: Hypothetically in my case of course, I’ve never encountered anyone attracted to me after transitioning.

[–]loveSloaneDebate King[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I don’t know how else to word this, just know I’m not saying it to be rude or to argue, you know I’m not great at wording things, but, to me, if someone is attracted to TW and they aren’t gross or creepy about it, then I don’t think it’s automatically that they are fetishizing you or trying to insult you. They’d be genuinely attracted, and it seems like it’s less about the man (or woman I suppose) who is attracted and more about how the trans person takes it. Meaning, regardless of how a trans person may feel about being trans, they are in fact trans, so to dismiss someone who excepts accepts you and wants you for who and what you actually are because they don’t see you as something that you technically just literally aren’t seems like doing a disservice to yourself (not you specifically, some hypothetical you). I’m just trying to say, they may not be attracted to you as a guy, they may be attracted to you as a transwoman. I obviously don’t know I’m not attracted to TW, but I think there could easily be a difference between a “chaser” who does fetishize you and someone who is just attracted to transwomen. That’s why I asked if a trans person dating a non trans person would be fetishizing them, because if the answer is no, it could be true in the reverse.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I don’t know how to properly articulate this, but I think someone who is particularly attracted to specifically trans women can’t ever not be creepy or fetishistic. They would be attracted to us for what we view as a deformity. It’s gross to even consider.

This is as opposed to someone who is attracted to a trans women but not simply because she is trans. But like a cis person specifically looking for trans people, I will never view as not creepy. While someone who is just open to dating trans or non-trans people is a different case. Does that make sense?

[–]loveSloaneDebate King[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I guess it kind of does, but I think the reason I’d think there may be more to it than a fetish is just that it seems like most TW haven’t had bottom surgery, so it’s hard for me to think that they’re all being fetishized by the people they date. But again I’m not trans so I’m just speculating. Like, I get someone could meet a TW and be interested before knowing they’re trans, but I can’t imagine that many people would be open to staying in a relationship with someone they aren’t sexually compatible with just because they liked them before they knew they were incompatible. Idk it’s not a hill I want to die on lol, it’s just something I was thinking about

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I honestly don’t know about the stats on bottom surgery. The vast majority of trans women I know have had it or are saving for it, but I may have a skewed perspective because of my age and whatnot.

But there are just extremely skeevy guys that are dedicated to dating pre op trans woman and everything I’ve seen involving them is just slimy and gross.

I don’t know about the flip side though. Like someone into men isn’t going to date someone who looks like a woman and doesn’t have a penis. Like... why would they?