QT: What do you think about the AGP model and posts that are documented in itsafetish?

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[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

It’s a fetish doesn’t exactly count as unbiased sampling. It exists to demonize trans people.

Notice I never said that the actual number of the posts are indicative of the total number of AGP, but that documented there are consistent examples of trans people that follow proposed AGP models posting in trans subreddits. Those posts sometimes have a lot of upvotes and agreement which suggests in the trans community there is acceptance and encouragement of this attitude or behavior. Of course, not all transpeople agree, I'm not and never have said that.

If we're talking as if AGP and real trans people are two different things, which I don't know that they are because I see that self-identified AGP individuals do claim to suffer crippling dysphoria and I don't think the two phenomena are truly that distinct, then itsafetish serves to show that there are AGP who are not real trans, not to demonize all trans people, and show that the phrase "trans women are women" is not always true.

That’s the whole point of psychiatric involvement, to tell who is dysphoric.

I understand that. What I'm saying is the psychiatric movement isn't doing a good job of it. This would be best exemplified with individuals typically following the ROGD model saying their real dysphoria was caused by sexual trauma that wasn't investigated. This would be true with or without the ROGD, but you don't believe that it exists. Care to elaborate on why?

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

The whole “study” that popularized the ROGD idea was surveys of parents involved in known anti trans spaces. It didn’t talk to the actual trans people or trans parents in neutral or positive spaces.

You can’t claim that’s good data. And any “sudden appearance” could easily be explained by simply not wanting to share with obviously anti trans parents.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I will give you that the sources for this study are from sources that are anti-trans or gender critical. I don't personally believe that spaces which have some criticism of the current state of transgender medicine are automatically anti-trans, but there are definitely people who are anti-trans there. As for whether or not it is good data, I'd like to paste the conclusion from the study.

This descriptive, exploratory study of parent reports provides valuable detailed information that allows for the generation of hypotheses about factors that may contribute to the onset and/or expression of gender dysphoria among AYAs. Emerging hypotheses include the possibility of a potential new subcategory of gender dysphoria (referred to as rapid-onset gender dysphoria) that has not yet been clinically validated and the possibility of social influences and maladaptive coping mechanisms.

I agree that the study is not a comprehensive view. However, it also does not claim to be comprehensive, nor does it even seem to argue anywhere that these people are not transgender. Specifically it states a possibility of a new kind of gender dysphoria that can be investigated more. This typology does seem to actually reflect cases I've seen on r/detrans and more research gathering stories from detrans individuals is underway.