Opinions on the "twin studies" of gender identity?

submitted by DistantGlimmer from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]SnowAssMan 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You're making two assumptions: dysphoria proves MtF transgenderism & MtF transgenderism proves that trans-womxyn are women.

Dysphoria isn't an identity. "Cis" people can have dysphoria too.

If we discovered conclusively that being gay was in people's DNA, would that somehow prove that gay men are women? No, because that is a non-sequitur.

Of course trans people exist. They exist the world over, as well as throughout history. Every culture up until now has recognised trans-womxyn as either men, or third gender. What is still lacking is evidence for the controversial, unsupported & frankly completely unnecessary claim that trans-womxyn are women.

Gender identity via gendered socialisation is the only real gender identity. It's actually measurable, consequential, definable. Trans-womxyn's socialised gender identity is also male, hence their gendered behavioural patterns being sex-congruent.

[–]DistantGlimmer[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Yes, I will never believe that transwomen are women because women are female and males can't become female. Some kind of biological gender identity would not change that at least in my eyes. What I think is at issue with these studies is the cause of actual dysphoria. If there is some kind of biological cause to it then we can't just dismiss transwomen as men who try to "act like women". I don't believe "cis" and "trans" as they are modernly used are valid categories actually, because as you said so-called "cis" people can experience dysphoria and extreme discomfort with the gender roles we are assigned and even perhaps physical discomfort resulting from this so a "trans" person is just someone who's dysphoria is severe enough they choose to act on it in some extremely noticeable way (other than just cross-dressing or something). It's just interesting if there is a biological component to this rather than being completely social and would impact how transsexuals probably should be viewed.

I also have questions about how this relates to gender socialization. Can we still hope to completely change how men and women are socialized and make a more equal and genderless society if parts of it are hard wired? I think so but it definitely needs more study.