Never forget that the lab leak was a “conspiracy theory” that the New York Times’ head Covid reporter called “racist.” If you think I’ll tire of recalling this, my friends, you are wrong.

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[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

This is misinformation. Doctors didn't just pluck Ivermectin out of thin air. They picked it because it was already known as a safe, cheap anti-viral.

It's not an antiviral. It's a antiparasitic. It's antiviral effects noticed in vitro, were only at concentrations that were unreachable in vivo.

Ivermectin affects viral cell entry, nuclear transport, and inhibits replication via RdRp.

In vitro.

As of April 2023, there are 96 studies with over 135000 patients comparing Ivermectin against control groups that support Ivermectin as a safe, effective treatment for Covid

Lets go through them shall we?

Skipping the first one, which is a preprint, the next one "Clinical Disease Characteristics and Treatment Trajectories Associated with Mortality among COVID-19 Patients in Punjab, Pakistan", isn't very compelling for ivermectin: p = 0.129 is plausibly due to chance rather than ivermectin, and the 95% CI includes at the top that it made death up to 20% more likely.

Considering the plethora of evidence that ivermectin is ineffective, this p=0.129 is too weak to claim that it supports that ivermectin is effective.

[–]Vrepit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

I've used it a few times when I was experiencing an early flu onset that was making coworkers be bedridden for a week at a time. It literally stops a viral infection from propagating further within 6-8 hours...does not reverse it, but puts it into a limbo. I was back to work the next afternoon with minimal symptoms. The only side effect I had was drowsiness, which coffee fixed.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

It literally stops a viral infection from propagating further within 6-8 hours...does not reverse it, but puts it into a limbo.

All viral infections?

HIV?
Herpes?
Hepatitis B?

Can you link me to the studies?

[–]Vrepit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

My comment was in the context of a flu virus. There's no need for embellishment on my original statement. Even though Ivermectin's antiviral properties have been previously established, with Sars-Cov being a recent concern, much more research has been done in clinical environments.

I'm not your research assistant and it appears you are not genuine or honest with your query. Any one else that has interest in Ivermectin's antiviral properties, can simply search for the studies on Pubmed.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Even though Ivermectin's antiviral properties have been previously established

Not in vivo. Quite the opposite. To achieve antiviral effect the concentration would have to be about 100 times what is possible to reach in vivo.

Any one else that has interest in Ivermectin's antiviral properties, can simply search for the studies on Pubmed.

JAMA is probably second only to NEJM with respect to American medical journals.

  • These findings do not support the use of ivermectin in patients with mild to moderate COVID-19.

Whereas if you look for research published in NEJM you find:

  • Treatment with ivermectin did not result in a lower incidence of medical admission to a hospital due to progression of Covid-19 or of prolonged emergency department observation among outpatients with an early diagnosis of Covid-19.

You may be able to find lower quality studies that suggest the opposite. But the best information to date is that it doesn't do shit against CoVID-19

I've never heard of it being used to treat influenza. I presume no medical professional prescribed it for that.

[–]Vrepit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

It certainly does appear to have notable efficacy, particularly when used early. We really don't need to just rely on a handful of studies when doctors from all over the world have been using Ivermectin on covid patients and databased their findings which support that it is effective.

https://c19ivm.org

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

It certainly does appear to have notable efficacy.

Why did the two top american journals publish that it doesn't within the past year or so?

Is this some new meaning "certainly"?

We really don't need to just rely on a handful of studies when doctors from all over the world have been using Ivermectin on covid patients and databased their findings which support that it is effective.

Really. What's this database called?

https://c19ivm.org

I've been lnked to that list of papers here before. Whenever I try to go through them from the top to see if one of them is good evidence for the efficacy of ivermectin for treatment of CoVID the person who links to it drops out of the conversation, by hurling insults.

Would you like to see if any of them provides good evidence of the efficacy of ivermectin for the treatment of CoVID?

Or would you prefer to trust me that there is no evidence?

[–]Vrepit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The data that supports Ivermectin as being effective alone or in conjunction with other treatments is clearly spelled out in hundreds of studies with patients that I linked. You've crossed the Rubicon and have passed the point where it was better for you to just remain quiet. I'm very sorry to hear of your loss in this convo....at least you tried and maybe you were compensated for it whether that be tangible or more intangible like ego stroking. It's a good indicator of character to understand when to speak and when to remain silent. I will catch up with you later on a topic that your scripted responses have shown to be more reliable to you and give you another chance. Vrepit Sa.

[–]ActuallyNot 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

The data that supports Ivermectin as being effective alone or in conjunction with other treatments is clearly spelled out in hundreds of studies with patients that I linked.

Lets look at the first one then: Recent Advances in Inhaled Nanoformulations of Vaccines and Therapeutics Targeting Respiratory Viral Infections

This paper looks at nanoforumlations that target virus respiratory infections. It looks at the concentrations of invermectin (and several other treatments) that can be achieved by this administration route, but it doesn't consider the effectiveness or safety of Ivermectin against any variant of CoVID-19 in humans.

So it does not in any way "support Ivermectin as being effective alone or in conjunction with other treatments", much less spell it out clearly, because it doesn't address that issue.

[–]Vrepit 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You are cherry picking 1 of several hundred studies. I clearly see you. I can't help but understandably laugh a little at you. No offense, but surely you have practiced self introspection at some point and maybe to your chagrin understand what I speak of?

Perhaps a partner or someone intimate with you has already mentioned previously that you struggle in certain areas of your life that has affected the quality of your relationships with these people? We can see a microcosm of this play out in your social awkwardness in confronting uncomfortable facts. Your responses are waning on substance as you have found yourself on indefensible and shaky ground. It's ok Friend, just reflect now, breathe and as you now learn to let go with every exhale. Vrepit Sa.