A man who was a lifelong Democrat until a few years ago: "Look, the left has been taken over by control freaks and radicals. The moderate liberals are just trying to get along but the hard left is calling the shots now and they don't give a rat's ass about virtue - they want to conquer."

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[–]Spud 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Yeah, I hear a lot of that.

Those of us progressives, who are not at all into the emphasis on identity politics, tend to call those people "social justice warriors."

The way I see all that is as an over compensation. And it's not at all good.

Don't get me wrong. I am anti-discrimination. But I am equally anti-fear blame and shame type politics too. Take racism:

One can have two basic conversations along those lines, and one of those is "you are a racist!" Well, great. Now we've got a personal judgement out there, someone speaking to someone elses intent without any real insight to it, and any chance of a reasonable conversation shot to hell quick. Multiply that by a few decades, and yeah. There is a lot of anger, inability to communicate and with those things, basically no understanding others.

Understanding one another is super important, particularly now.

The other conversation avoids most of that and is sort of, "That could come off as racist..." and it's talking about the thing, impacts, not so much the person. And it sure as fuck doesn't doom someone right out of the gate.

What is notable is what can happen after the conversation. When the first one is had, people have to come back from something they may not even have intended in the first place! So, often they just don't. And they sure as hell don't want the ones judging them to be the ones they have to come back to, or admit acceptance or any other damn thing. Divisive, and it's everywhere.

With the second one, people can think it all over. If they make different choices going forward, great! Nobody even has to know. The world can just get better with more people presenting mutual respect and consideration more of the time. So much is organic too. It's not some formal thing, more like more people understanding one another better and with that can do better by one another.

Labels are hard. So many are using them too. Couple that with the fear, shame, blame labels, etc... and it's a mess. Way too many people check out, basically unable to have a nice conversation, or even a solid one, fair etc... so they just don't. Over time, that is all isolating in the democracy sense, and it leads to low turnout, and lots of other artifacts which leave the door open for growing unease, just a higher risk, higher cost, more difficult state of affairs.

There are many who have set aside this "left right" deal to get at things a different way, more focused on ideas, outcomes than people, conformity, blame. Frankly, it's not about what we did before, who we voted for, whatever. It's actually about those things about to happen, those choices we can make tomorrow.

Freedom from illness, or health care as human right are one example. Pretty much everyone, good, bad, whatever, needs to deal with medical things like all humans do. Many nations have sorted this out reasonably. People don't lose homes, go broke, file bankruptcy, nor put off things they should give attention to. It's an entirely different way of thinking. One can be poor, but not unhealthy, for example. Or one can be a small business owner not having to worry about sick people, or premiums pricing good people out of reach.

For that to work, it's gotta be an American conversation. I need to see the doctor, you need to see the doctor, how can we all see the doctor without all this damn carnage going on non stop?

And here's another thing those social justice warriors really don't like very much:

Other people just don't have to be nice, or step up. Gay people, for example, have had the benefit of a great many people standing for them. It's been more normalized and for more of those people, more of the time, in more places, life can be OK to really good. I want it good, to be who I am, others want it to be good, be who they are. Sort of makes sense.

But, that's been extended to some entitlement or other.

YOU HAVE TO DEFEND MY RIGHTS!

Really?

No I don't! I'm an ordinary, straight, white guy. I can absolutely not give a fuck. Now, I will give a fuck because of the above, wanting it good, not living lies, etc... so sure! I'm happy to toss in, carve out a space where more of us can live, laugh, love who we want to, but HAVE TO?

Line too far, if you ask me.

And whether someone agrees with that, and I'm totally open on that conversation, there is an even more galling thing!

That social progress has come at a pretty damn high cost. You've mentioned some of it. Economically, that cost is high too. By moving the focus so strongly toward social only policy, economic policy has not gotten a balanced representation at all.

Again, whether one agrees or not, here's my point:

Those same peeps who DEMAND and say WE MUST, won't lift a fucking finger when it's their turn to step up, take a little heat, do their less fortunate peers a solid. The same damn solid they DEMANDED of others.

I hate that shit.

Viscerally.

Which is why I come back to getting along. Understanding one another better. Where that's going on, I feel most of the issues, both social and economic, will sort out reasonably. That's what democracy does generally.

But when it's abused? It fails, and we've got a mess.

[–]Chipit[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I'm not sure what to make of this ramble. I get the idea you're not "progressive" (i.e. far left) at all.

It simply doesn't matter who you are on the left, the crazies are driving the bus. And they're full of hate for Americans. Do your part to banish them back to whence they came, because they sure as hell don't listen to us. That's what this video is about.

[–]Spud 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I am not going to do anything of the kind. Nobody that matters on the left is hating Americans. Besides, that doesn't really work. Never does.

What does work is being FOR things. Against type politics isn't doing any of us any favors you know.

People generally associated with the Sanders campaign aren't doing or about anything mentioned in the video. Won't be either.

What they are about is getting money out of politics, economic policy that gets right at that majority of Americans struggling right now, and in general, being good humans about it all.

You are right, I'm not far left. I'm left of center by any reasonable, global measure.

I also don't care what your politics are. I do care about advancing that policy, getting ordinary peeps a better scenario to work in / through.

This is all a priority discussion at the core. Do we want to squabble about who hates who, or do we want to make sure people can go see a doctor and do so without losing homes, loved ones, for example, and be around and healthy able to have the hate debate later?

That's a much nicer problem to have, in my view.

[–]Zahn 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

How much of a role do you see the Federal Reserve having in contributing to many of the economic issues facing the US?

[–]Chipit[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Nobody that matters on the left is hating Americans.

That's the whole point of this video. Everyone who matters on the Left hates Americans. You are apparently a minority so rare as to be unique.

I'd love if reasonable people like you took over the Left and made it sane again. But you've got a lot of work ahead of you. They are pissed off and hurtful and want revenge for voters having the nerve to reject them. Don't talk to me, get out there and fight to get sanity back on your own side.