Who to blame?

submitted by fschmidt from (self.nonmorons)

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[–]jet199 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

The idea of nice goodness is very recent.

In the past might was right. Only sociopaths rose to the top. Society managed this by having a system of removing them when they got too powerful or stopped being useful.

Unfortunately as society has got kinder and nicer those ways to get rid of powerful men have been outlawed so we have to put up with them unless you can prove they have broken some rule.

[–]fschmidt[S] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Nice goodness is old. Tribes had it. Even packs of animals have it. Scaling it up was hard, but the Ancient Athenians figured it out.

In general, a limited democracy of religious non-morons will not be dominated by sociopaths.

[–]jet199 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

Equality in tribes is managed by everyone constantly competing to keep everyone at the same level. Human jealous exists so strongly that happiness and self esteem depend more on what others around you have than what you have. In tribal societies this jealously works to keep people working up and knocking others down to the same level. It's not nice, it's brutal, it just looks nice when you're not involved personally.

Tribes were exactly what I was talking about. Most have some systems whereby if a big man gets too much power a group of elders will get together to force him out or even have him murdered. This was how humanity worked for thousands of years.

This is exactly what also happened in ancient Athens. Almost all their heroic, beloved leaders died in exile or were killed. Ancient Greeks also very much believed that might is right. Their heroes were mad men and murderous psychopaths.

[–]fschmidt[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I hardly know what to say since everything you wrote is simply wrong. But why don't you tell me about ancient Athens, which of "their heroic, beloved leaders died in exile or were killed"? Not Solon or Pericles, their best leaders.