"This is how crazy the USA and European policy is. They are having Ukraine "Peace Talks" in August and not even inviting Russia to participate."

submitted by Orochiwe don't need no water let the mother[honk] burn from (twitter.com)

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[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

At the Copenhagen meeting [in June], there was a large gap in views between Ukraine and most of the attending developing countries, according to people involved. Ukrainian officials pushed participants to back President Zelensky’s existing 10-point peace plan, which calls for the return of all occupied territory and demands that Russian troops exit Ukraine before peace talks can start.

The developing country group made it clear they were open to discussing shared principles but wouldn’t sign onto Ukraine’s plan.

While the U.S. and Europe are publicly backing Kyiv’s peace plan, Western officials say it is clear the global talks will only succeed if they are crafted around a set of widely shared international principles, like the UN charter, which stands up for territorial sovereignty and political independence and condemns acts of aggression and the threat and use of force.

(because they're blatant hypocrites; cf. Yugoslavia, Iraq, Libya, etc.)

A senior European diplomat said Ukraine was still pushing for international backing on issues that developing countries won’t accept—for example, a broadening of sanctions on Moscow. India, Turkey, Brazil and China have eschewed Western sanctions on Moscow.

The thing that the West and its lackeys in the media cannot grok is that non-Western countries' desire to broker peace in Ukraine does not mean they can be bullied into supporting the West's continuing ambition to cripple/destroy Russia. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. I only wish that Saudi Arabia et al. would insist that Russia be made part of this discussion because discussing peace between two warring countries without including both of them is the height of lunacy.

[–]weavilsatemyface 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I only wish that Saudi Arabia et al. would insist that Russia be made part of this discussion

I'm pretty sure the Saudis are fully aware that peace talks without both warring parties is a waste of time. My guess is that this is their way of cosying up to the US by giving the US what they want: a PR win.

Never mind that the Saudis have clearly and brutally put the US back in their place, they have (correctly, in my opinion) recognised that the political leadership of the US is so complacent and full of itself that it doesn't care about the Saudis joining BRICS or selling oil in non-US currency, they don't care about the Saudi-Iran treaty or the Saudis normalising diplomatic relations with Syria. They don't care that the Saudis did these things, but they do care about the loss of face from the world seeing the Saudis do them.

This is the Saudi's way of saying "Only kidding America, we still love you" without actually changing any of their diplomatic, economic or military policies. That gives the US the PR win that they want, so their collective ego will be soothed and they can go back to imagining that all they have to say is "Jump" and the Saudis -- and the rest of the world -- will say "How high?"

[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I think you make a great point here. US leaders can't be completely blind to the shifting winds in the world but they keep plowing ahead with the tactics they used effectively when we were the dominant military and economic power as though no one will notice it no longer exists.

[–]weavilsatemyface 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

US leaders can't be completely blind to the shifting winds in the world

You underestimate how bubbled and blinkered they are, and how few truly differing opinions they hear -- and those that they do hear, they have completely immunised themselves from considering alternative viewpoints by instantly labelling everything they don't like as "Russian propaganda" or fake news or "a conspiracy theory".

[–]penelopepnortneyBecome ungovernable 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's kind of interesting how this is playing out - unintended consequences and all that:

Brig. Gen. Moussa Salaou Barmou, the chief of Niger’s Special Operations Forces and one of the leaders of the unfolding coup in Niger, was trained by the U.S. military

U.S.-trained officers have conducted at least six coups in neighboring Burkina Faso and Mali since 2012. They have also been involved in recent takeovers in Gambia (2014), Guinea (2021), Mauritania (2008), and Niger (2023).

“We train to standards — the laws of war and democratic standards,” said the U.S. official. “These are foreign military personnel. We can’t control what they do. We have no way to stop them.”

If NATO-backed and Nigerian-led ECOWAS doesn’t swiftly defeat the newly formed Sahelian Coalition of Burkina Faso, Mali, and Niger (with Guinea possibly joining them in some capacity), then Russia is expected to tangibly support the latter, thus leading to a New Cold War proxy conflict in which Chad could be the kingmaker.

[–]Orochiwe don't need no water let the mother[honk] burn[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

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