Indefinite Blackout: Next Steps, Polling Your Community, and Where We Go From Here

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[–]SusanJ 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (7 children)

So, are we doing a Friday Night Dance Party here?

[–]MartiniPlease send olives! 🍸 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

yes, I'll do one here -- but I won't be running a regular wednesday party :)

u/blackhalo thanks for the ping - and please note I'm absolutely terrible (so far) at keeping track of saidit msgs...

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

The question has been raised....

https://saidit.net/s/WayOfTheBern/comments/ayx1/day_four_of_twoday_strike_well_now_what/

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

are we doing a Friday Night Dance Party here?

There was a Wednesday one....
https://saidit.net/s/WayOfTheBern/comments/ayid/3andfro_suggested_a_midweek_dance_partycake_day/

I don't think there would be any way to not have one. If the subreddit is still locked up tight, somebody's going to declare a FNDP here.

I just hope that two people do not do that at the same time.

[–]SusanJ 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

Yep, saw the WNDP after I asked:)

And what, you're not in favor of a dance off... :)

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

I generally prefer collaborative to competitive, when given the choice.

[–]SusanJ 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Me too, actually!

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

/u/Martini ?

[–]rondeuce40DC Is Wakanda For Assholes 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Whatever hapens, the blackout needs to be sustained and long term. The larger subs that make up the bulk of reddit's traffic can impact profits which should be the goal. Remember these CEO types only understand one language and that is the language of money.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Whatever happens, the blackout needs to be sustained and long term.

From an article in Adweek:

If the performance weakness continues for a week or two, the agency would start recommending decreasing spend with Reddit or directing it to other platforms.

https://www.adweek.com/social-marketing/ripples-through-reddit-as-advertisers-weather-moderators-strike/

[–]rondeuce40DC Is Wakanda For Assholes 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It will be interesting to see if the user base is capable of refraining from scrolling for any extended period of time.

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Is that why WotB is still locked on Reddit?

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Probably.

Consider the "one day gasoline boycotts." Completely ineffective, because they do not effect the monthly balance sheets.

If, however, people could do a "Do not buy Exxon (for example) gas for an entire month" boycott, that would have an effect.

Two days is not enough to have much of an effect. Besides, picture the SpezSpaz when "two days" turns into four, and counting.

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Bud Light has entered the chat.

The "two days" as a dry run for more serious protest, is not a bad plan. Every year I hear calls to protest Black Friday shopping, that never comes to pass, because the idiots don't do a practice run in advance, to rally the troops and see if they can impact sales.

[–]captainramen🇺🇸🛠️ MAGA Communist 🛠️🇺🇸 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Sigh. They had me until "Touch-Grass-Tuesdays.” This cringe brain-dead meme is reason enough for reddit to be utterly destroyed

[–]BerryBoy1969It's not red vs. blue - It's capital vs. you 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don't think reddit really gives a shit. Just like the Dempublican uniparty, reddit knows they have millions of good citizens redditors who believe the rings in their noses are just an anti-establishment fashion statement.

The systems dependent consumers of reddit, are just fine with being the units of production they need to be, in order to preserve and protect the niche identities they've been assigned by our owners media.

Ignorance is bliss - reddit is bliss collectively personified.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

I will say this, tho...

The first person Turtled on Saidit is in for a hell of a surprise.....

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 8 insightful - 5 fun8 insightful - 4 fun9 insightful - 5 fun -  (1 child)

Already happened :)

One today got a few shell failings, and one yesterday went instantly to modmail with a "This is not reddit, your "turtle" nonsense is retarded." :)

Which reminds me, I've got something to do with the banner tomorrow if I don't forget again.

[–]risistill me 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I hope the poster of dickish slurs was the first shelling.

[–]Promyka5When in the course of human events... 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

My only (slight) reservation is that the posts are fewer and slower here, but if we were to migrate, that'd be all taken care of, wouldn't it?

And the best part: no more drive-by trolling by shitlib Redditors who want to show us their asses!

[–]risistill me 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

And the best part: no more drive-by trolling by shitlib Redditors who want to show us their asses!

I hope you're correct, but I think they'd troll us here.

(This is redditrisi.)

[–]ageingrockstar 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

and the urgency of getting the news of the ongoing war out to /r/Ukraine obviously outweighs any of these concerns

Blerghhh

(Meanwhile r/russia is still a 'quarantined' sub, which is disgraceful)

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (58 children)

So, quick question to those who migrated here from Reddit over those past two days: how's it been?

[–]rondeuce40DC Is Wakanda For Assholes 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

For purposes of keeping up with WOTB stuff, there's not too much of a difference aside from volume. I have to familiarize myself better with the platform. What is missing for me is all the shitlib subs I like to keep track of to monitor the narratives from Zombieland. That and a few music subs, but that's a minor concern.

[–]ageingrockstar 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (28 children)

Apart from the refreshing lack of censorship, the interesting thing I'm finding about seddit is the lack of a downvote button

And in a way the two are tied together, as downvoting someone is a form of censorship (i.e. you are trying to suppress/hide that comment or submission)

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

the interesting thing I'm finding about seddit is the lack of a downvote button

It took me a second to notice this, but there is also a lack of an upvote button.

It looks like there is one there (well, two, actually), but those aren't "vote" buttons.

[–]ageingrockstar 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I didn't upvote this, I marked it insightful

[–]risistill me 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (21 children)

My opinion:

Censorship on board (or a sub) is silencing only, whether by hiding or deleting a post, or by banning a poster.

Downvoting is expressing an anonymous opinion about a post (or a poster).

[–]ageingrockstar 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

Downvoting is expressing an anonymous opinion about a post (or a poster)

Yes, I agree with this characterisation too

I was playing with an idea in my comment above. Is censorship only removal and/or blocking participation? Or is it suppression too? Downvoting is suppression (your voice is not silenced but it becomes harder to hear). So I was only playing with the idea of suppression being a milder form of censorship, but again, I generally agree with how you characterised it. If I didn't I would be a hypocrite, as I don't believe in censorship but I have downvoted ppl on reddit and other fora where the facility exists.

[–]risistill me 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (11 children)

IMO, the aural metaphor is unnecessary and only confuses the issue. Or maybe it just whooshed over my head. In any event, let's go with reality:

How does downvoting make a post harder to read?

[–]ageingrockstar 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (10 children)

Where we're talking about free speech, the 'aural metaphor' is natural (actual speech is soundwaves). Speech can be silenced or it can be turned down in volume / drowned out (suppressed).

How does downvoting make a post harder to read?

Downvoting makes the post harder to come across, i.e. reduces its visibility

[–]risistill me 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

Downvoting makes the post harder to come across, i.e. reduces its visibility

Not for me. But that's because I post only in one sub.

ETA Wouldn't the same be true of just not voting at all? That is what we are limited to here to show disapproval.

[–]ageingrockstar 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

That is what we are limited to here to show disapproval

That's how saidit is different and where I started my rumination.

On reddit there are 3 options :

  1. downvote (suppress)
  2. don't vote (no effect on the post)
  3. upvote (boost)

While here we only have

  1. don't vote (no effect)
  2. upvote (boost)

I think the difference in these two systems is interesting. In the 2nd one, nothing gets suppressed, only boosted.

I can see the arguments for both and I haven't made up my mind yet which I prefer. But it's interesting being exposed to essentially a clone of reddit (they forked the code base) but which uses the 2nd system.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

Apparently in elevators, the "close doors" button that most of them have does absolutely nothing but make the person inside the elevator feel like they are doing something.

That's the system I would like to see:

  1. downvote (no effect on the post, number that downvoter sees goes down by 1)
  2. don't vote (no effect on the post)
  3. upvote (boost)

It would be difficult to see what difference a downarrow used just to make people feel like they're doing something would have.

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (6 children)

downvote (no effect on the post

Yeah that works until you see Logical__Conclusion sitting at 1 Karma.

[–]CaelianPost No Toasties 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

At the Reddit WotB, there seemed to be a lot of automatic downvoting, perhaps by 'bots. Those downvotes were not expressing an opinion about particular posts or comments -- they were just mindless vandalism.

[–]risistill me 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Maybe, but humans downvoted too and those downvotes were expressing an opinion. I'm guessing bots also upvoted, which they can do here.

Edited to make an incoherent post a bit more coherent!

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Maybe, but humans downvoted too and those downvotes were expressing an opinion

Some did, others were simply "me no likey" which only counts as an opinion during elementary school :)

Plus the added issue that downvotes are used by the platform to determine visibility, not for expressing opinions, which is why it became a tool to bury content that doesn't fit the authorized narrative.

Not having them removes the conflict and pushes opinions to be explicitly expressed through an actual reply.

Perfect? Probably not, but I do like that approach and am curious to see how it scales :)

[–]risistill me 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Some did, others were simply "me no likey" which only counts as an opinion during elementary school :)

In your opinion. (-;

I get downvoted if I post "it's a rainy day" during a global monsoon. I'm okay with that.

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

In your opinion. (-;

Damn, where's the downvote button!!1! :'(

[–]risistill me 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

See?

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

But that's just because you're evil :/

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

Yup, it also cuts on the trolls' self-congratulatory ceremony of thinking "there, I showed them!"

Google should have copied this instead of just removing the downvote buttons on YT :)

It's not clear as of yet exactly what this would become if and when the shitlib (paid) trolls from Reddit found their way here, but then again, their handlers may not care much about SaidIt whereas Reddit is clearly on the list of "social networks that need to be thought-managed".

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

their handlers may not care much about SaidIt

Yet. If it gets popular enough to move elections, they will come.

[–]CaelianPost No Toasties 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Reddit is clearly on the list of "social networks that need to be thought-managed".

Hell, wasn't WotB mentioned in Newsweek a while back?

[–]risistill me 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

That is not necessarily inconsistent with reddit (implied: and not saidit) being a platform seen as needing narrative control.

The pool of potential lurkers at reddit is likely greater than the pool of potential lurkers at said it. (if the indicator is correct, ten people are here now.)

[–]CaelianPost No Toasties 12 insightful - 1 fun12 insightful - 0 fun13 insightful - 1 fun -  (23 children)

It's nice not tangling with trolls all the time. Playing with the cat toys was sometimes fun, but it's sure nice not having all those Logical___Conclusion posts. I suppose if we migrate here permanently the rats will follow at some point.

I think Reddit would be glad to have us back-benchers self-deport.

[–]risistill me 3 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 3 fun -  (21 children)

You can always block.

Not having blocked anyone was an private point of pride for me for years of posting. Until I blocked one Bothersome troll (who didn't research after the 2020 Presidential election ended). Since then, I've blocked more of them.

As my sibling once said of adulteries by a former spouse: "It's like murder: The first one is the hardest."

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The problem with blocking is that Reddit changed it from an individual blocking feature (which I used quite a bit against trolls at the time) and a censoring/hindering tool now. My point of pride is in not using it since then :)

I'd have liked to be able to clear my blocked list as well, but since the concept of pagination hasn't been invented yet, the page times out and is unusable. And of course the new.reddit/mobile app versions are even more useless.

I'm guessing that on SaidIt the block feature works normally, so there should be no issue. One more thing that Reddit fucked up for no reason.

[–]risistill me 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Reddit's blocking censorship has been much harder on the poster who has been blocked than the poster who did the blocking. I guess they never considered snowflakes blocking people for little or no good reason.

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

They don't seem to have considered much of anything with any of their design/development decisions since new.reddit, at least.

Kinda like this whole API thing. It's like there's a pattern of incompetence in there somewhere, on top of the pattern of all-around douchebaggery :)

[–]risistill me 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

"Follow the money" is perhaps both the best and most terse political advice ever given. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Follow_the_money

It often works for commercial enterprises as well. Reddit is kinda both.

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (7 children)

The lack of a downvote here, leads me to block more. I dunno if that is a good thing, or not.

[–]risistill me 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

Only a few "here," in comparison to our reddit home. (never anticipated posting "reddit home"). However, we already have guest posters, albeit not the kind that we "hosted" at reddit.

So far, I haven't blocked. Just not replying.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 2 fun -  (5 children)

So far, I haven't blocked. Just not replying.

I call that a "shadowblock." They're blocked (mostly) from my eyeballs, but no one knows that they're blocked.

[–]risistill me 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I don't know about saidit. However, at reddit, an account I've blocked cannot reply to me or to anyone in a subthread that a post of mine starts. So, at reddit, there would be a significant difference between a block and simply not replying to a poster.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

However, at reddit, an account I've blocked cannot reply to me or to anyone in a subthread that a post of mine starts

We recently discovered a technicality: someone you blocked cannot reply to you, cannot reply to a reply to you, cannot reply to a reply to a reply to you....

But more than three steps down, can comment.

(Programming: Look three steps upthread. If anyone in that chain has blocked this person, don't let them comment.)

[–]risistill me 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I never counted before. I'll have to check.

The first poster who blocked me was especially annoying because he posted on almost every thread. However, after what seemed to me like a long time, he got shelled and left WOTB immediately afterward. Most of my blockings have come from accounts who are in WOTB only to comment on a pet topic, typically the political issues that, IMO, shouldn't even be political issues. So, they are not much of nuisance.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I never counted before. I'll have to check.

How we found this out was great. "Bastard blocked me!" "If he did, how are you telling me this downthread of one of his comments?" "idk"

Then came the research & experimentation.

[–]CaelianPost No Toasties 6 insightful - 3 fun6 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 3 fun -  (8 children)

I don't think I've ever blocked. What, and miss out on the fun? If I block user "NM" then I won't be able to appreciate later comments about "NM" 🐁

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

I always figured that blocking was merely for the faint of heart.

If letters on a screen upset you so much, maybe reddit/saidit is not for you.

Also, as you said, blocking only prevents you from seeing the letters, not anyone else.
And then the replies do not have proper context.

[–]Maniak🥃😾[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

If letters on a screen upset you so much, maybe reddit/saidit is not for you.

Depends on the case. It was purely a time management issue for me back when it was usable on Reddit (pre-WotB). Too many posts to keep track of in the first place, so obvious wastes of time were just that. Blocking them simply cleared up the view. Nothing to do with "oh my poor fee-fees surely can't stand this", shitlib-style :)

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It was purely a time management issue for me

Therefore my "if" does not apply.

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

And then the replies do not have proper context.

I'm pretty sure that you don't get to see the replies either.

[–]NetweaselContinuing the struggle 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I'm pretty sure that you don't get to see the replies either.

Well then... no blocking for me!
The replies are the best part!

[–]captainramen🇺🇸🛠️ MAGA Communist 🛠️🇺🇸 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

You block = you lose. We're winners here. Make the other person block you

[–]risistill me 1 insightful - 2 fun1 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Only if you see it that way.

[–]risistill me 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

What, and miss out on the fun? If I block user "NM" then I won't be able to appreciate later comments about "NM" 🐁

Apparently, this is a case of mistaken identity. I meant to reply to the poster who posted...

It's nice not tangling with trolls all the time. Playing with the cat toys was sometimes fun, but it's sure nice not having all those Logical___Conclusion posts

Please accept my apologies! (-;

[–]BlackhaloPurity Pony: Pусский бот 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

the rats will follow

I have doubts. Those folks are a symptom of the inertia Reddit represents. I don't think Share Blue has the brains to go chasing after influence on social media, until it bites them in the ass like it did in 2016.

[–]InumaGaming Socialist 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I honestly go to Reddit to pull information here and check up on a few people posting there.

I liked the freedom here more than I did the restraint and I can get over losing a sub or two.

Cultural entertainment, I'm taking a huge hit to find One Piece and HnI content but eh... I'll live.

[–]risistill me 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (2 children)

It's not either/or.

[–]InumaGaming Socialist 4 insightful - 2 fun4 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

It's true. We're digital nomads so we go where the action is.

[–]risistill me 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

I have r/WayOfTheBern bookmarked on my toolbar. If WOTB sojourns here indefinitely, I will remove that and bookmark some other reddit sub on my toolbar. Meanwhile, I will bookmark s/WayOfTheBern on my toolbar. With both reddit and saidit on my toolbar, "travel" will be easy peasy.