Haunted by a 1984 quote and looking for perspectives from fellow women

submitted by Rationalmind from (self.GenderCritical)

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[–]Radish 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

I find it to be inaccurate. I don't usually give a lot of credence to male authors on the subject of women, although I find it interesting to have the view into men's thoughts about women. It reminds me of how I am seen by them when they are interacting with me. The quote is a generalization about half the human race, based on the underlying unfounded anger that men seem to have toward women. Obviously, the character is having issues of his own (sexual frustration) and blaming it on women. Orwell's books that I've read say very little about women, and the female characters tend to be two dimensional when they exist.

I'm not sure what is haunting you, or what you mean by "a problem with women." The most ardent followers of religion are women, despite the fact that all religions treat women as second class citizens. I always thought this was because women are the most severely punished when they step out of line, and they want to be good and virtuous and do the right thing. This is how we are socialized. Approval seeking is very much part of female socialization.

Men are the ones who benefit from keeping women in line. They also benefit from having other women (Mary Daly used to call them "token torturers") do the work for them. We also tend to give men more of a pass on things, and treat them as though their thoughts are more important. We are less likely to see the antagonizing and piling-on. You do not say what the subject of the thread or threads were.

As an aside, I think everyone is reacting to your post strangely because it sounds a bit odd. I mean, one doesn't really hear people say "fellow women" and it sounds kind of strange. Perhaps English isn't your first language. People here tend to be a little overly cautious of trolls, so that is probably the reason for the wariness.

[–]Rationalmind[S] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I don't usually give a lot of credence to male authors on the subject of women, although I find it interesting to have the view into men's thoughts about women.

I don’t disregard a speaker on the basis of sex, or race, or religion, or sexual orientation, or political ideology, or any other superficial reason. Knowledge is knowledge despite its source.

one doesn't really hear people say "fellow women"

English is my first language. It’s more that I think for myself and have a grasp on English in a way that it may be strange to you. It’s the Internet, not formal writing.

I'm not sure what is haunting you

The quote struck me and stuck with me because my intuition and experiences tell me it’s likely true.

everyone is reacting to your post strangely because it sounds a bit odd

No, “everyone” is false. Most of voices have generally been in support.

[–]Radish 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I don’t disregard a speaker on the basis of sex, or race, or religion, or sexual orientation, or political ideology, or any other superficial reason. Knowledge is knowledge despite its source.

Nice soundbite, but when evaluating writing, especially when questioning the veracity and applicability of it, knowing who the author was, where they were from, and what their background is, would be germane to the subject at hand. You were wondering if there was truth in this writing. I believe that it was true only as far as it is common for men to blame things they don't like on women, whether applicable or not. Both the character and author are male, and the quote contains tired stereotypes men use against women, therefore, I don't give it much credence or think it to be accurate. There is a sort of weary "things haven't changed much" to my thinking.

English is my first language. It’s more that I think for myself and have a grasp on English in a way that it may be strange to you. It’s the Internet, not formal writing.

I don't think so. People still don't say "fellow women"

The quote struck me and stuck with me because my intuition and experiences tell me it’s likely true.

Okay. So what is it that's bothering you about it, then? If it strikes you as true, and your experience seems to reflect that opinion, why are you asking questions.

No, “everyone” is false. Most of voices have generally been in support.

I did use "everyone" inaccurately to reflect the reaction I saw in most of the posts. However, it wasn't my intention to make you defensive. I simply thought it possible that you were looking for an explanation, since you seem to react to the responses here with a bit of hostility. ETA: In this thread, you keep talking about how insightful you found Eric Blair to be. Then you say the source doesn't matter. I get some really weird mixed messages from this whole thread. I hope you got whatever it was you wanted from this thread. It inspired me enough to actually write instead of just read, so that would be a good thing.

ETA 2: Tired old stereotypes are tired old stereotypes regardless of their source.